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JonPeat -

Juggler.net - Query

Hi All,

Whatever happened to the juggler.net email redirect service?

The most recent discussion I can find about it took place here:
https://www.jugglingedge.com/forum.php?ThreadID=1777&SmallID=12414#Small12414

Firefox will not let me follow the link the website as it is 'unsafe'.

I would like to create a juggler.net redirection account.

How can I make this dream a reality?

Any and all advice gratefully received,
Cheers, Jon

Little Paul - - Parent

Will Firefox let you go to http://juggler.net/email.shtml

If not, the most relevant bit of the page is:

To sign up for your free email diversion package, simply send an email to forwarding@juggler.net telling us what you would like your Juggler.Net email address to be (eg your_name@juggler.net) your name, and the email address you want your email forwarded to. - Easy!

JonPeat - - Parent

Very helpful, thank you Little Paul!

Exactly what I needed.

Cheers, Jon

York Jugglers - - Parent

Ooh! We have a juggler.net question too:

We noticed when we mistyped the url, that the url redirect is case sensitive; ie www.juggler.net/leeds works, but www.juggler.net/Leeds doesn't.

Is there any way to turn off this case sensitivity or do we need to set up www.juggler.net/Leeds and www.juggler.net/LEEDS etc to all redirect to the Leeds Juggling Concention website?

Tried e-mailing the juggler.net volunteers a while ago, but not got a response yet

Oh don't forget Leeds Juggling Convention 17 November 2018*, more infrmation on website



* Provisional date

Little Paul - - Parent

URLs on the internet generally are case sensitive (well, the bits after the '/' are anyway), so what you're seeing is normal, not just for juggler.net but for most of the rest of the internet as well.

Whether redirects can be made case insensitive depends on how they're done, and it looks like the details I've got for access to the system don't work any more (not surprising, I've not really had anything to do with juggler.net for several years) so I can't check.

The easiest thing to do would probably be to request multiple variations.

Kelhoon - - Parent

The usual trick is to do something like map all requests to lowercase (e.g. turn /Leeds and /LEEDS in to /leeds) and then redirect to that.

You could also map to upper (LEEDS) or ucfirst (Leeds).

So it's doable, but not common practice because most people just click on links that always have the correct casing.

Mïark - - Parent

I also found the juggler.net website was blocked at work

AnnaBod -

BJC survey

Hi all,

I've put together a survey aimed at people who attended BJC this year. Please fill in if you have a chance.

This is to help future organising teams convince towns and venues that we are a worthwhile event - one of the ways of doing that is by showing we spend money in the local area! Your answers will also help future teams to improve BJC, and help work out what is worth spending money on.


https://goo.gl/forms/q86tF4GI6Yafj14C3


Already really interesting data coming out of it. Rough calculations so far (scaling up the respondees total spend on attractions and accommodation to the number of over 18 attendees) indicate that this year's BJC was worth at least £25.5k to the local area. That is a good number to present to local councils/tourism boards etc.

Orinoco - - Parent

Done.

Is there a deadline for responses? Will we get to see the results.

AnnaBod - - Parent

I am enjoying the comments section of the form very much. Whoever it was that completed it most recently is my favourite comment so far ;-)

So I'm planning on a couple of reports... one very much aimed at local councils and tourism bureaus with the spending jugglers do and local impact we have, and the other for BJC orgs about what people want and don't want from a BJC.

The most sensible place to put these is the BJC wiki, so that's where they'll go.

AnnaBod - - Parent

Deadline... a couple of days? I need to write up before this baby arrives, which is anytime from now!

furlisht - - Parent

Done! For the question "will you come next year", you could add an option to specify "No because of EJC". I myself would come back in 2020 because there is no EJC there!

Mïark - - Parent

It cannot be guaranteed there won't be an EJC in the UK in 2020, the vote to decide where EJC 2020 hasn't taken place yet.

Mïark - - Parent

>>>> where EJC 2020 = where EJC 2020 will be,

furlisht - - Parent

Indeed you are right! We'll see ;-)

AnnaBod - - Parent

Closing this at the end of this evening, so fill in if you can :-)

It's Him -

Walking Globe trick ideas requested

Most of you will remember that I asked for ideas for tricks on the walking globe a while ago. For those people who watched BYJOTY this year you will have seen some of where that has led. Bearing this list of tricks that I will post below in mind, what other ideas can people suggest? You will gain my thanks for any usable ideas which aren't just perform (Other prop) on walking globe.

Nigel

Tricks in show:

Leap mount of walking globe (other mounts are available)

Jumping between two walking globes

Passing two hoops around the body in opposite directions

Skipping/Backwards Skipping/Crossed-Arms skipping on globe

Double skip dismount

Mounting a spinning globe and then staying on it by a) moving feet and b) not moving feet

Walking on two globes at one time

Performing a 1up 180 whilst on two globes

Under the leg juggle whilst on two globes

Turning 4 ball half shower whilst on globe

5 ball multiplex followed by 5 ball flash on two globes.

Tricks not in show but done elsewhere

Frog balance on globe

skipping whilst on 2 globes

jumping onto 2 spinning globes

no handed standing to sitting to standing

collecting 3 ball from floor whilst sitting (standing tried and not close)

one footed stand on globe (very difficult)

2 person 1 globe facing same way, facing each other and with one person turning

3 person 1 globe

4 person 1 globe (so far only for a few seconds)

moving globe by jumping

lying flat on globe

forward roll over globe

probably a bunch more I've forgotten

Orinoco - - Parent

I'd like to see someone do a pommel horse circle on a walking globe

https://youtu.be/-AlXvMXzDYE

7b_wizard - - Parent

Is it maybe possible to use it like a trampoline and to slightly jump and fall into sit-jump back to stance?

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Ouch. I think you're confusing walking globes with those Swiss inflatable aerobic balls... You'll find that walking globes are incredibly hard and sturdy, one would not want to fall with their buttocks on those...

7b_wizard - - Parent

ah 'kay.

Mïark - - Parent

Handstand with each hand on a different walking globe, as seen at Manchester BJC (photo on page 3 of The Catch magazine)

It's Him - - Parent

From the hand positions this looks faked, as in the globes would roll away if they weren't stuck in a hole. However handstand on a walking should be possible (and eventually two globes) just possibly not by Peter.

Thanks Miark.

Nigel

Buck Rudder - - Parent

Just seen this wonderful act the other day
https://youtu.be/_hHWm81ZIjU

It's Him - - Parent

Really nice little act. I enjoyed that and whilst I think I've seen virtually all the walking globe skills in other acts it's good to see them all put together well.

Nigel

It's Him -

BJC2018 – A review

This review is my personal thoughts of the last few days and may be idiosyncratic.

Tuesday

We arrived in two cars as my car had two walking globes init as well as part of an aerial rig and therefore only the front two seats were useable. By the time we had set up the caravan and oldest sons tent (which he pitched about as far from us as was possible), it was time to eat. Then I played the yearly game of find the water point (why is it never marked on the maps?). Eventually we were all sorted and we looked around the site, chatting to friends as we went. At some point we went to the gym and Peter did an hours practice (added a time waster move with two globes) which like many of the practices at BJC had Peter struggle with the 1 up 180 with 3 balls, whilst stood on two globes. He could run it fine when not running the whole act. As soon as the music started and he tried it two minutes in to the routine it became much harder. After that we did a bit more chatting before an early night.

Wednesday

After breakfast we did another hour practice with Peter(changed 4 ball on one globe with an under the leg throw to 3 ball, 2 globe and under the leg throw). After that I went to add a workshop to the board (walking globe, naturally) and the fire alarm went off. No idea what set that off but at least it was a one off. At some point during the day Jamie Fletcher appeared with my new toy, a red and yellow Salerno ring. I haven’t had a lot of success with it as yet but should have plenty of practice time and space in the near future to improve. Spoke briefly to Clare about BYJOTY to learn that only 3 had entered to that point. Spoke shortly afterwards to Christopher and suggest that he practice the act that he had performed the month before and then enter BYJOTY. He is one of the students at Concrete Circus and whilst it is an act in development, the experience and feedback from BYJOTY would be good for him.Various chatting and food happened until the start of the Spinning@ show.

For me the first half was basically filler. Whilst there was some good technical skill most of the acts were too long or too repetitive. The best of them was the rope dart but that act could have been shortened and maybe some of the tricks could have gone above the audiences head. Of the other acts,the only comment I’m going to make is since when has clearing up after yourself been an act?

Our friends the Kelsalls arrived during the interval which pleased my daughter particularly (and us as well as we then didn’t have to explain the compere to her) and they got to see a really good second half. Starting with Ben Cornish. Ben was having a bad time with one trick but his performing experience showed through. We also had a really nice Bar Flair routine by Sam, a pleasing, smooth and aesthetic hoop routine by Alice, a very competent (and much improved since I last saw it) hulahoop act from Lisa and Callum and for me the stand out act in the show the cigar box routine by Luke? Cigar box routines are rare anyway but to show great skills with 3, 4 and 5 boxes made it much better. The final part of the act was a standard made better by music that worked well (even though the music was for the next act, which didn’t help them I’m sure).

After the show chatting happened and then I retrieved my juggling case from the sports hall, where it had sat for a day. I did some passing with my sons, including some feeding and switching who was feeding.Considering that Peter hadn’t done two count club passing before that evening,that was a great improvement.

Thursday

Again we started with an hour practice with Peter (changed the skipping part to have two jumps rather than one). After that some more chatting happened before I attended Euaun’s combat workshop. That was good fun and the only workshop I attended other than the walking globe workshop that happened immediately afterwards. I was impressed with the turn out to the workshop as there must have been about 25 who attended. I worked with the beginners, many of whom learnt to walk on the globe, whilst Peter worked with those who were more advanced. Nobody was killed or seriously injured which counts as a result in my books and actually quite a few people came up to thank me afterwards and it wouldn’t surprise me if Lancaster University juggling group buys a globe.

At some point in the afternoon I played the one game I played all convention. I don’t remember its name.

The show in the evening was the Open Stage. Devil Stick Peet compered and did a small act between each act which meant he now dominates the show in my head. Other acts that impressed were (in no particular order) Antonia and Keith with their passing poi (I liked the characterisation), The odd ball juggling person (Daniel?), the professional looking poi double act and the duo acrobalance. There were other acts and none of them were bad, I just can’t remember them at this time.

I did a bit more juggling and passing afterwards and thus this became the convention I have done most juggling at for a few years.

Friday

Up early again for another practice session with Peter(added 5 ball multiplex on 2 globes). After that I generally chatted although I did meet up with Barbara at some point to discuss aerial rig bags. We had the debate of going on the bus or driving to Margate and went for the bus. Arriving at Dreamland (so called because that is where dreams go to die?) we hung around and watched some of the games. I took part in the balloon dog making one although felt hampered because I felt obliged to pick up the pump and then it got in the way when I was blowing up the balloon with my mouth. David did creditably well in the unicycle gladiators before being taken off his unicycle by someone hugging him and then suiciding. Shortly after that we left Dreamland(with its hall with more hole than roof) and went across the road to the beach and promenade. We stopped for a while at a large set of steps where David proved that he can bunny hop and Olivia Kelsall showed that she is an up and coming artist. We chatted to one of the local families and tried to convince them to watch the show later. Our evening meal was pizza at a sea front restaurant. The door to the place was particularly difficult to open and as we sat outside the restaurant eating we gained much amusement as other people(including staff) struggled to get in and out. After eating and walking closer to the show venue we also had an ice cream and eventually reached the venue before the vast majority of jugglers but only just. This did allow us to have seats in the centre of the theatre.

For me the show felt very safe. By which I mean that most of the acts were well known and had appeared in the BJC gala show before. Jon Udry was slick and his dry humour works for me. Ben had an interesting and novel act, perhaps not quite enough juggling for me but still enough to keep it interesting. Jan Himself was very professional in an almost predictably weird way. Paul Zenon’s magic routine had a lot of standard tricks which were all well presented. The end of his routine I thought was a somewhat bizarre staged event at first but apparently that wasn’t the case and one of the stage hands took it upon herself to interrupt his act. I hope someone apologised to Paul afterwards. The second half was equally skilled. Loz because performed a routine which was both well choreographed and well programmed, I always think that glow props take a little bit away from the performer and their skills but Loz was visible enough that we could see much of her tricks. Helena Berry has an act that isn’t very forgiving and the drops grew more towards the end but this didn’t take away from the act which was original and skilful. The Berlin Passing Girls did a great choreographed act and probably inspired the girls in the audience into believing they should juggle more. Steve Rawlings has been in at least 3 other BJC gala shows and is always a crowd favourite. For me the highlight of his act was the bit that I haven’t seen before with the mouth stick bottle and balloon. Matthew Tiffany as compere did a great job as compere and introduced a song that is fairly hard to sing if you have all the words written out in front of you.

On the way back from the show I learned that if Steve Rawlings does his knife gag in a show and you are 3 then you will still remember it 9.5 years later.

Saturday

Guess what, we started the day with another practice session(changed the skipping so there was a slick turn before the second jump). After that I had a long conversation with Jonathan the Jester and probably chatted with others. After lunch I visited the traders with my daughter who needed anew peddle for her unicycle. Roger managed to sell her an upgraded set of peddles (pink) but not a new tyre (also pink) just because she had a pink unicycle stem and was wearing a pink cardigan doesn’t mean that she is obsessed with the colour. 2pm was tech rehearsal for BYJOTY so we all went over there. Originally there were going to be 8 acts but one of them was clearly not ready and will probably do a better job next year. After watching the tech run I thought that it would be very close indeed between 3 acts, the two twenty year olds and my 14 year old son. It turned out that I was correct. If you congratulated Peter and he didn’t say anything back to you it wasn’t because of you. For someone who is happy to stand up in front of people performing he isn’t great at conversation. After that we treated Peter to a meal of his choice, so we ended up going to Pizza Hut.

Sunday

It's Him - - Parent

Sunday

We didn’t do an hour of walking globe practice. Instead we slowly packed away and said our goodbyes. Peter bought some balls from Oddballs with his voucher forgetting a silver medal. Eventually we left for the journey home. Around about J30 my car engine started making funny noises and got gradually worse so I pulled over just before J28. Fortunately one of the Milton Keynes jugglers saw us and took Peter home (the other 3 were in the other car). I got to play the very slow game of waiting for Mr AA Man and eventually got home some 9.5 hours later. A sad end to an otherwise great BJC.

It's Him - - Parent

I noticed that in this review I forgot to thank all the people who made BJC happen. You are all wonderful people and I enjoy spending time with you each year.

Nigel

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Yes, the odd ball juggling person on the open stage was me :)

It's Him - - Parent

I enjoyed the act. I generally enjoy acts that have characterisation and have been thought through and yours met both those criteria.

Nigel

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Thank you, I'm glad to hear that :D

The Void - - Parent

#BJC2018

Jonathan The Jester - - Parent

I have to say how Impressed I was with BYJOTY, esp the astounding walking globe. I have not been that gobsmacked since Sam Goodburn wheel walked his uni. Very very good stuff. As always it was great to catch up with Nigel.

JonPeat - - Parent

Nice review Nigel!

Pssssst Orinoco... you aren't waiting for me really, are you? Mine is going to be a good few days yet at least...

Orinoco - - Parent

Nope, I am working on it but I've only got up to Thursday so far...

Monte - - Parent

Cold showers, cold bed but great new Bristol backdrop mug.

JonPeat - - Parent

Hi Everyone,

I also went to the BJC in Canterbury and wrote about my experiences!

Check out all of the action here: https://www.juggle.org/british-juggling-convention-2018-review/

Enjoy!

Cheers, Jon

p.s I enjoy reading other peoples reviews and experiences, add to the discussion with your own mini reviews!

peterbone - - Parent

Interesting that you tried to attend the preventing injury workshop. Frederique and myself were the only ones there unfortunately. Ben did it anyway and we found it useful and informative.

JonPeat - - Parent

I am very surprised that so few people went along.

Fortunately (or unfortunately...) any injuries I recieve which prevent me from juggling are normally due to things outside of juggling (cycling accidents, mis-handling of tools etc...) or avoidable impacts from juggling combat.

I was very interested to hear what Ben said and would definately go if the chance came up again. It just didn't work out for me this time.

Orinoco - - Parent

Ejuggle appears to be down at the moment :(

I'm hoping to finish my effort this evening (probably late evening).

Mïark - - Parent

I did wonder if juggle.org was just not working for me, or if Jon had broken it.

jamesfrancis - - Parent

Thanks Jon, as always I really enjoyed that.

Very interesting to see how you always have a completely different juggling experience to me: a rare attendant to shows or workshops and a frequent attendant at the lazy juggler bar!

My main thoughts / feedback / witty or non witty repartee in no particular order or coherency are as follows:
- Margate had excellent fish and chips away from the main strip. We skipped dreamland and the games completely and played adventure golf (curse you Andy Fraser for taking my title) and really enjoyed our day out and nearby Fish.
- I really enjoyed the gala show but thought too many of the acts were a little similar. It was probably the least balanced gala show I had seen for a while. I love Tiff, Jon and Steve, but all in one show with a talking magician and a talking Ben was a lot of wordy performances. Helena was really quite good though.
- Was the stage hand who interrupted Paul Zenon really not a poor acting planned part of the act? we couldn't tell
- Monte food = excellent. Much better when he has a full kitchen and helpers to work with. Rarely needed to leave site for sustenance other than drinkable water
- Lack of flushable toilets...at one point I think there were only 2 working on site. Thank goodness the portaloos turned up
- Waffles are not an acceptable breakfast. Why can we not get decent coffee anywhere ever at a BJC?
- Played two long games of Suburbia and Stone age with Brook, Cameron and Danny. Stone age seemed to be more popular. Also played a bit of seven wonders duel with various people. This is my latest favorite two player game of choice. Also Danny needs banning from all board games on account of being too good.
- Generally the organisation was a little lax. The volunteer board didn't seem to exist and on inquiring how I could help I was told 'go and see if anyone is on badge control now and you can fill in'. Well I did and a couple of hours later I was lucky to be replaced as the person after me had no relief after 2 hours. A simple printed schedule people can sign up to is so much easier.
- Sebs workshop on 3 in one hand scissor manipulations was great
- I felt really sorry for the unicycle hockey guys for pushing my patience. The Scheduling as you mentioned was awful but it wasn't their fault and I was temporarily very angry until I thought about this
- Love being able to drive to BJCs and bring my double duvet to camp with. Feel like a big southern pansy, but no regrets!
- I need to pass more with different people. I did no > 2 person passing other than 'Spider' and mostly passed with the same people. Made some progress on Funky 9 though. Also amazed at the number of people who can now acceptably run Holy Grail. A few years back this was a pipe dream and now it seems almost common. Need to regress a few years, quit my job and move to Cambridge to keep up.

James

The Void - - Parent

"- Waffles are not an acceptable breakfast. Why can we not get decent coffee anywhere ever at a BJC?"
From which conjunction I conclude that you think decent coffee is an acceptable breakfast. I agree, but enjoyed a couple of veggie Full Montes in the week too. Seeing Bob Fromcanada around made me miss his great coffee stall that was at EJC.

Monte - - Parent

I have never understood why people for whom coffee is so important cannot bring along the means to provide their own. SMH

jamesfrancis - - Parent

I could... but given my campsite was at least 5 minutes walk from the main communal / juggling area, and that I would have to whip out a camp stove, boil my own water and bring my own fancy cafetiere in the first place this seems a rather extravagant means to an end.

Much easier to rant on the internet than self provide a simple practical solution. That being said I am sure there is a commercial opportunity there given the success of EJC ventures.

John R - - Parent

I could being the Leeds convention filter machine along, but it’s not PATed so insurance mght be an issue...

John R - - Parent

I do, thanks! Aeropress and hand grinder. But there is a bootstrap problem in that some people - not me, cough cough - need a coffee before they can be organised enough to make coffee.

JonPeat - - Parent

Nice mini review, I think I spotted you juggling in the hall a couple of times during the week...

I would be up for a game of Duel sometime, great game!

James -

Hi all, I'm James. I am London based double staffer, currently working on the second convention of the distracted arts. A half day flow and juggling event out in Egham. The event will be followed by the M25 fire night, which to celebrate the convention will have some performances before the general fire spin.

The Void - - Parent

Hi James,
Welcome to The Edge. Here's the tag for your event:
#Eghamcircusconvention
(That means people can now find this thread from the event page, and vice-versa.)

Cheers,
Void
(Who remembers double-staff fire sessions in Preston Park a million years ago. When my car was stolen, I was more annoyed about losing my 2 Barnes staves that were in the back, than about the car. Hey ho, life goes on, as Cougar sang....)

The Void - - Parent

PS I like "21sh April". Does that mean "21st-ish"? :-D

Mïark - - Parent

Did you choose to hold your event on World Circus Day or is that just coincidence?

Monte -

Otters juggle! Who knew?

https://youtu.be/_RwmtrjeInc

Mïark - - Parent

wow! next you will be telling us that Asian Black Bears know how to staff twirl

7b_wizard - - Parent

°Gee° .. all the years of hours of daily practise this must have taken!?

Just a question of time now until they too invent computing and digitalize their world, then be first on mars, I say.

The Void -

Is Lestival happening this year? I heard it was, but it's not on https://www.jugglingedge.com/events.php .

LizzyPeat - - Parent

Yes, I have it down for the 5th of May...

Mïark - - Parent

Looking on the UK juggling conventions facebook page, I see Lestival have a facebook event

They also had some very good looking flyers at Chocfest

Maybe they don't know about Juggling Edge's event listings.

The Void - - Parent

Thanks Mïark & Lizzy. I did DuckDuckGo, but found no site for this year. At least I can share the fb thing if needed. Cheers.

Monte -

Is the BJC dying a slow death?
I've not been for a few years so I was quite surprised to hear how few are expected to attend this year. Fewer than half the amount of people that used to go about 10 years ago.
Is this a sign of a fall in the numbers of young jugglers taking up the hobby or are there just more events dividing up the pool of likely attendees?

The Void - - Parent

BJC numbers are always down when it's in a "far corner" of the UK. Of course, we're well down from the early 90s heyday, but that's been true for years.

The Void - - Parent

The last 2 with figures for attendance on https://thebritishjugglingconvention.co.uk/wiki/index.php?title=BJC_History (both in Darton) are over 900. That's pretty good. I'm sure Perth will have been well down on that, and I guess it makes sense for Canterbury to budget on a low figure too. We'll see how it goes, I guess....

Monte - - Parent

I wouldn't have called Kent a far flung corner. Not compared with Yorkshire. I suppose I'd need to know more about the concentration of jugglers around the country but I would have assumed London and Bristol to be hotspots.
Anyway I hope you're right because 500 seems a small number to me.

The Void - - Parent

Where are you getting 500 from? *If* it's their budgeting figure, that's presumably a worst case scenario, and therefore it wouldn't be unreasonable to *hope for* 600-700. Dunno, I'm guessing...

Monte - - Parent

From the horse's mouth. Budgeting figure is even lower.
Good to know the last couple were around 900. That's a good number.
When people are deciding between BJC or Catch it can't be a good thing.
There has to be a number where it is no longer viable in its current form.
Mind you, under 500 and we could do it at Hulver farm
British Balls Up anyone?

The Void - - Parent

There are no numbers on that site for attendance for the last 2 (anyone know?). 900s were 2014 & 2015.
Well, here's hoping...

Cedric Lackpot - - Parent

> When people are deciding between BJC or Catch it can't be a good thing.

Why not? I see that it's a risky situation, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's wrong. It seems to me that the BJC does not have a right to be pre-eminent, it needs to earn that status.

Monte - - Parent

I meant it can't be a good thing for the BJC. It might well be a good thing for juggling.
It already seems quite hard to get people to commit to running one, if numbers decline who's going to take the risk of making a big loss?
Maybe both can be successful?

Anyway, come to BJC and eat at Montegriffo's.....

Richard Loxley - - Parent

I wouldn't have called Kent a far flung corner. Not compared with Yorkshire

Spoken like a southerner ;-)

I'm currently a southerner, living in Bristol. But I'd still rather travel to Yorkshire rather than Kent! There's this annoying thing called London in the way, which adds stress and considerable time, whatever method of transport you use.

I will make the effort anyway, because I want to go to the BJC. But I can see why anyone in the Midlands or above would think twice.

Monte - - Parent

Southerner? Norwich is further North than Birmingham.

Mïark - - Parent

Canterbury is more than twice as far from the centre of the UK population as Darton is.

Monte - - Parent

Where's the centre of the UK population?
About one in seven live in London, must be getting on for a third of the population are South of Watford.

The Void - - Parent

From a comment on an Ordnance Survey page: "Yes, one of our Twitter followers suggested this too. It’s not something we’ve worked out ourselves, but @MurrayData says that using a population weighted approach centre of GB is approximately 433924E 309573N (Measham Rd Swadlincote Leics.)"

The Void - - Parent

Click the pic link in the tweet:
@JugglingEdge Pic for Monte: pic.twitter.com/Bitwm1Fb67
— The Void ザ・ヴォイド (@TheVoidTLMB) March 10, 2018

Cedric Lackpot - - Parent

Yeah, erm, Swadlincote's in Derbys not Leics - only just, but Derbys nevertheless. Not a good start, although if I had to guess the GB population centre I'd probably go for somewhere not too far from Swad.

Also, Swad is mostly an unmitigated shithole, but then that probably makes it a good representative of some sort of median of the British population. I have worked a lot in Swad.

These Swad facts brought to you by Cedric Lackpot, who has nothing of value to add to this thread, but knows a damn thing or two about Swadlincote!

Mike Moore - - Parent

I'd like to subscribe to Swad facts by Cedric Lackpot please.

Cedric Lackpot - - Parent

J. Thomas Looney died at Swadlincote in 1944. 'Nuff said.

Llama_Bill - - Parent

Measham Road to Darton BJC - 1:20
Measham Road to Canterbury BJC - 3:07

lukeburrage - - Parent

The main reason I won’t be returning to the BJC again soon, and the reason why I don’t recommend it to European jugglers when they ask me about it, is the time of year and the accompanying high chances of bad weather.

That’s the reason I’m not going again this year. The better time of year is also the main reason I’m going to the Catch festival this year.

If the BJC was held in July, I’d probably go every year.

charlieh - - Parent

That's rather a silly reason not to recommend it, Luke. Yes, some BJCs have had awful weather, but plenty have had good weather, even the ones held in the far flung North. Also, last time I went to the Lakes in the summer we had really quite a lot of rain.

There's no guarantee of good weather at any time of year, although it's likely to be a lot warmer in the summer of course. I'd be more inclined to talk about the shows, workshops, halls and general vibe of the BJC than the weather - if nothing else, to avoid becoming a national stereotype!

lukeburrage - - Parent

Not, it's not a silly reason. It's a major factor for me, and judging from the feedback I get from non-UK jugglers who visit the BJC, it's also the main complaint they have.

In Europe, if a convention is held in the winter, camping isn't expected. It's an indoor sleeping convention, with entire sports halls or other rooms set aside for people to lay out mats and sleeping bags. If the convention is late spring to early autumn, camping becomes an option. The BJC insists that camping is an option, even when the chances of bad weather is worse than good weather.

For example, Berlin held its convention in September last year, due to some date conflicts, and everyone expected the weather to be fine. But it wasn't. It was waaay colder than it is in May or June, the normal date for the event, and it got dark way earlier. So now the convention has moved back to the summer again.

Just so you know, the shows, workshops, halls and vibes at the BJC are no better than other national conventions in Europe. There is nothing to recommend them above conventions at better times of year and with better weather than the BJC. The chances of bad weather in March in Scotland though? Camping on the top of a mountain in Yorkshire in April, with tents being blown away? No thanks!

Rain isn't so much of a problem if the temperature isn't too bad. Just the difference from March to May was enough for it not to be too stressful for us to camp at Bungay. But the BJC that same year? Nope, we got a B&B.

Stephen Meschke - - Parent

Canterberry in April:

  • High: 52°F
  • Low: 39°F
  • Average 7 days of rain.
  • 13.5 hours of daylight (+1 hr of twilight)

Cumbria in July:

  • High: 63°F
  • Low: 48°F
  • 16 hours of daylight (+1.5 hrs of twilight)

lukeburrage - - Parent

If you are wondering about reduced numbers of people at the BJOC, I think the comparison you want is Perth, Scotland, in March and anywhere in the UK in July.

Perth in March:
Average high 6.4°C
Average low 2.1°C

Canterbury in July:
Average high 22.8°C
Average low 12.9°C

Penrith (closest city to Appleby) in July:
Average high 19.4°C
Average low 10.5°C

Conclusion: if the BJC was in July, anywhere in the UK, I'd probably go and be okay to camp every year.

Little Paul - - Parent

What’s with the crazy units?

Cedric Lackpot - - Parent

I may not agree with a whole lot of what Luke has to say - and I'm pretty confident he's perfectly cool to be disagreed with - but I confidently and assertively agree that the climate is not a silly reason.

And it's certainly nowhere near as silly as saying that the British climate is unpredictable at all times of year, and therefore implying that the probability of seasonal or non-seasonal weather is immaterial regardless of the time in question!

There are a number of good reasons to hold BJCs at or around Easter - the weather is not one of them.

rosiejane - - Parent

I have to agree, the damn weather and having to camp is always a factor that is lurking in the background, taking the edge off my anticipation. I am not the best camper - can't sleep well in a tent, so this year for the first time we have opted for the local Premier Inn. It does feel like a cop out but seeing as my hot water bottle is going to the IJC I couldn't face a week sleeping in a cold tent.

That being said the British EJC in 2019 will be in August and I am hoping that it will be considerably warmer and with little rain! Newark is only 50 miles from Swad so not far off being pretty central and we really really hope that we can entice as many jugglers, hoopers, diabolists, aerialists etc to it as we can.

As it is in Britain I am hoping to attract not only all the wonderful people from all over the world who come to EJC but all of those Brits that have never been to one before.

I know there is another EJC before it (2018 - Azores) but I am just slipping it in now so it's in your subconscious!!

PS the EJA are looking for a team for 2020, so if you know someone who might be interested in finding out more about organising a huge event like the EJC then send an email to info@eja.net

lukeburrage - - Parent

Let me ponder my BJC camping history:

2000 - so wet I never pitched my tent, and slept in the car instead.
2001 - some nice weather, but freezing cold one night and as it pouring with rain on the last day, it was the least pleasant final day of a convention ever.
2002 - after two years of terrible weather, I skipped the BJC completely! I went to the Israeli convention instead. The weather was amazing.
2003 - didn't camp, got a room at the university instead. People complained about ice on their tents. This was Brighton, not Scotland, so the location isn't always the most important thing.
2004 - performer, and was provided accommodation.
2005 - performer, and was provided accommodation.
2006 - performer, and was provided accommodation.
2007 - performer, and was provided accommodation.
2008 - performer, and was provided accommodation.
2009 - got myself a B&B, but as this was a summer convention, I would probably have been happy to camp.
2010 - BJC switched back to a winter convention again, and I decided to skip it again.
2011 to 2013 - nope.
2014 - borrowed my parents' camper van.
2015 - camper van not an option, didn't want to camp in the same place where the previous year peoples' tents had blown away.
2016 - nope.
2017 - B&B again.

Ah look, I literally only camped at a BJC once! The only reason I kept going was being either by paying for accommodation myself, or being offered non-camping options for performing various acts in various shows.

Premier Inn is not a cop out, it's the only way sensible adults will keep returning to a camping convention in the winter/early spring!

Squibly - - Parent

This seems to be a wall of evidence that you have very little experience of camping at a BJC, but didn't enjoy it one time 7 years ago.
Doesn't seem fair to the British scene to spend so much time and energy discouraging others on that basis Luke.

lukeburrage - - Parent

It's not just the camping. It's the general wet and cold atmosphere. In 2009 the convention was in the summer in Norfolk. I went to the FIRE SHOW. I sat outside and watched the fire show and it wasn't the most miserable moment of my entire year. Do you know how amazing that felt? A BJC fire show which wasn't utterly unbearable to watch. Wow. And in the evenings we were hanging out on the grass between the gyms. The renegade show tent didn't need space heaters. Nobody was wrapped up for winter for no reason at all except the sun had gone down. We could watch the Sharpe brothers do their street show, just outside one day, and it wasn't remarkable that the wind wasn't so bad they couldn't do any diabolo tricks.

Then my next BJC, when hosting the games, I had to make announcements that people's tents were blowing away, and they should go check on them before we left for the gala show.

It's not about my camping experience, it's about having a relaxing time at a convention.

Again, the Berlin convention miscalculated with holding it in September last year, and the very next year it is back to June, based ENTIRELY on the weather and how soon it got dark. How did it take them one year to learn the lesson but the BJC keeps at it?

I hope that after the Catch this year and the EJC next year, people will finally learn, and the BJC can be a summer convention from now on. Or at least a late-May to late-Augst convention.

Orinoco - - Parent

It is true the BJC fire show is consistently unbearable to watch, but I have never attributed that fact to the weather.

The Void - - Parent

*Tries to donate a fiver to The Edge, for that comment*
*Finds out there's a minimum £10 donation*
It wasn't *that* funny. Cash at BJC do ya?

Little Paul - - Parent

It’s no Crawley fire show that’s for sure

charlieh - - Parent

As others have said, you've hardly ever camped at a BJC so I don't think you're really qualified to comment. I've camped at BJCs since 1993 (Birmingham) with a few gaps and I've never felt particularly cold, been woken up by bad weather or had a leaky tent. It has *been* cold, I agree, but with decent clothing and a good sleeping bag that's not a problem. Yes, it can be cold & wet outside but I've also sat outside on the grass in a T-shirt some years. In fact the one time I've been flooded out was at EJC Ptuj (which was the very definition of wet and cold and miserable).

Of course the BJC could be in the summer. It has been, in Norwich, after plans for the usual time fell through, as you said, and it was lovely and warm. It could be any time from late May (but don't you dare schedule it against Bungay, otherwise I shall be *really* scathing). It could be at Christmas. But someone has to stand up and volunteer to run it at that time and this bid has to be voted through at the business meeting - you know how this works. They'll then have to contend with competing with other festivals (including non-juggling ones), university exams and all the others things that may not have such impact in late March/early April/Easterish, availability of venues not in the Easter holidays and lots of other factors.

There's no point writing 'people will actually learn' in the hope it will happen - it will take someone to stand up and come up with a concrete plan for a summer BJC. As you know, there's no British Juggling Association running BJCs <nails lid firmly back on big can of worms> just whoever stands up and volunteers a year of their life.

I think we have an interesting situation this year with Catch! which is kind of an alternative BJC-ish thing in the summer with great acts in the show. This may well prove that a summer BJC-ish festival could work, in which case I look forward to many more bids of this kind.

lukeburrage - - Parent

No, I think I am qualified to comment. The point of my comment is that the bad weather has been the deciding factor in why I decided not to go to the BJC. And not just once. After York and Cardiff, I didn't go back to the BJC, and went somewhere else instead. Same in 2010. Same in 2015. Same in 2017.

The people who are happy to camp in the ice/snow/wind/rain/etc of the UK in March/April? You don't have to worry about them. But what about all the people whose first BJC was Derby in 2004? How many people didn't bother coming back the next year? Even though I didn't camp, I drove home to Newcastle with two people who did, and the stop in a pub on the way home for dinner, and sitting in front of the fire, was the first time they had felt properly warm and comfortable for the previous five days.

The people who don't go to the BJC are the ones qualified to talk about why they don't go, and are 100% correct about the reasons the numbers might be down... at least for the number they represent.

The people who DO go to the BJC, by the fact they can cope with the stress of bad weather, are not qualified to talk about the reasons the people who don't go aren't going.

Daniel Simu - - Parent

I've gone to the BJC once (I think 2015?). I had to sleep inside on the last night, it was a rainy festival.
I'm going again this year, very happy to bring my campervan!

pumpkineater23 - - Parent

That's a good point, no one likes going anywhere when it's cold and sodden. Why don't they hold the festival mid-summer?

It's Him - - Parent

The historic reason for the BJC being at Easter rather than in the summer is that performers are much more likely to not be working at that time. Whether as a performer in the show who charges less than their normal fee or as an attending performer who doesn't want to miss out on the lucrative summer months Easter makes much more sense. Touring circus often runs from after Easter until sometime in Autumn, so the timing would help them to attend. Nowadays BJC does not have as many professional entertainers and so this is not as good an argument as before. It still might mean that it is difficult to get the best professionals, although Rosie seems to be showing that a summer convention with enough funding can do that anyway.

Nigel

lukeburrage - - Parent

If you get 2,000 people at the convention, you can pay professionals to be there. It’s how the EJC works. There is no reason a BJC in the summer can’t attract 2,000 people.

It's Him - - Parent

I wasn't arguing in favour of an Easter BJC. I too enjoyed the summer BJC (although it cost me earnings). I was giving one of the traditional arguments for an Easter BJC. It makes sense for professional entertainers. I'm not sure it makes much sense for the majority of people who now attend the BJC.

Nigel

lukeburrage - - Parent

Yes, I understand. My first BJC in 2000, it seemed that the main influence on a large portion of the jugglers there was street performers and circus performers. These days the largest influence is other amateur jugglers. Why would anyone have a pair of stilts or a unicycle to take part in a parade? Why does the parade even exist? Does it still exist?

Little Paul - - Parent

Oh god. Parades. Please make them stop.

I know it's quite often a hook you can dangle towards the local city council to get some money off a venue, or land some other source of funding, but when you promise them a "colourful entertaining parade of jugglers acrobats and circus folk!" they picture an old fashioned circus parade. They picture tumbling acrobats, sequins and clowns. They picture free facepainting for the public, they picture ringmasters and jugglers and absolutely everything you can't deliver.

What they inevitably get is a bunch of people half heartedly walking along juggling 3 clubs or spinning a diabolo while talking to their mates and shuffling down the local high street. At best you might get one or two people wearing balloon hats, or a teenage unicyclist trial riding on every park bench or raised flower bed they can find.

Parades are at their absolute worst when everyone is only there because you made them attend the parade as a side effect of getting the bus into town for the evening show.

Parades are shit. "Because we've always done it" isn't a good enough reason.

Stop it

Just...

stop.

(and.... *breathe*)

lukeburrage - - Parent

EJC parades can still be good fun if the weather is nice. There's often an open air show on a specially build stage at the end of it, and those are usually worth seeing, like Smashed by the Gandinis in Almere (though not like 8 Songs by the Gandinis in Lublin).

Little Paul - - Parent

Is it the parade which is good, or is it the "show on the open air stage" bit which is good?

Because I would wager that of the two, the open air show is the bit that could stand on it's own. Do that, do more of that. Advertise it locally, get the public in as well, make a big deal of the fact that there's a show in town!

Who is the parade for?

If it's for the locals, then we're doing them a massive disservice (even EJC parades are closer to the atmosphere of a protest march than they are "rio carnival")

If it's for the jugglers, then what's in it for us apart from a show or "the games" at the end of it? If it's a show/games then why do we need to wander round the streets for an hour first? Why can't we be dropped off next to the show and just get on with the good bit?

Want to do something for the locals that actually shows jugglers in a good light? Put on more shows, run a street performing competition, run free-fringe style events in small local venues...

Just please, not a bloody miserable death march through town.

Daniel Simu - - Parent

As a young juggler I really enjoyed my first 5 parades or so.. Now after 15 at least it gets a bit unexciting yes..

charlieh - - Parent

I've really enjoyed the EJC parades I've been on, simply due to the amount of jugglers taking part - I think there's a critical mass. EJC Almere was particularly fun (especially our Ben occasionally pausing to show the crowd his single diabolo trick and getting rounds of applause - he was 6 at the time) and EJC in Carvin was mad, as it was at night and there was fire (health & safety??). I agree some BJC parades can be damp and disappointing.

peterbone - - Parent

I have exactly the opposite logic. BJC is my preferred convention because it's much cooler than in the summer. This means that I can juggle a lot without getting too hot. I don't care much about being outside. At most EJCs I've been to I'm unable to juggle most of the time because of the heat and I don't like to be outside in very hot conditions because of sunburn and other risks. I normally only go to the more northerly EJCs, although Joensuu didn't work out as I expected (40°C).

peterbone - - Parent

Also no fun when you have to leave your tent at 8am because the blazing sun is hitting it and roasting you alive. I've camped at every BJC I've been to and the only time I was cold was 2003 in Brighton because of the ice/snow.

pumpkineater23 - - Parent

You're not a tropical creature like me. Give me the early morning roasting sun anyday. I'd just go and find a nice shady spot and finish my sleep there. Or go to bed earlier. Camping in the snow.. are you quite mad? I went 'wild' camping at Brecon Beacons after the green man festival. It was horrible, damp and miserable.. couldn't wait for it to end. The only enjoying part I remember was when I was sitting in my car with the heating on.

furlisht - - Parent

I'm going for the first time from the continent just because it's close to the border! Don't kill my hype :P

Llama_Bill - - Parent

You'll have a great time. I've enjoyed every BJC I've been to. I am excited for this one.

charlieh - - Parent

You will indeed have an excellent time. Sadly I don't think I can make it this time (due to foreign travel for work the next week) but I'll certainly miss it.

Dee - - Parent

Enjoy - and if you have any questions, I'll probably be at the registration / information desk!

It's Him - - Parent

Given I barely saw you out of the kitchen, did BJC feel significantly smaller to you than previously? I understand that total numbers were around 700 but hadn't been properly counted when I heard Anna discuss this with Owen Morse after the business meeting.

Nigel

ChrisD - - Parent

Nigel, in your current thread "For several years now I have been suggesting a juggling competition for older…" you wrote "If the BJC doesn't happen next year (or even if it does)". May I ask if there there is any particular reason for suggesting there may not be a BJC next year?

Cheers,

Chris

Orinoco - - Parent

No bids to run it so far :(

It's Him - - Parent

During the Sunday meeting nobody stood up and said that they wanted to run a BJC in 2019. During the BJC I heard on several occasions people saying that there wouldn't be a BJC because EJC was in England next year. I am not strongly optimistic about a BJC next year because I haven't heard any great enthusiasm from anyone although I have now heard rumours about people thinking about it 'up north'.

Nigel

duncanh - - Parent

I know one person who has an excellent venue and good plans for putting a bid together for 2019. They've never run one but assisted, so know what's involved. Just looking to put together a local team I think. Hopefully their initial thoughts and ideas will come through and they'll make themselves known soon.
Another team was interested and had ideas of a venue but nothing firm.

Monte - - Parent

Seemed similar in size to the last one I did (Pickering). I did do very well but I put that down to being inside and having a full sized kitchen rather than my truck. Plus the excellant quality of my crew...

Ben -

Hello everyone!
Living in Washington DC, currently working on fun 3B patterns and 4B/5B multiplex patterns.
Feel free to say hello!

7b_wizard - - Parent

Hi Ben!

Little Paul - - Parent

Hi Ben!

Mïark - - Parent

Hello!

Mike Moore - - Parent

Hello!

Real_Ego_87 - - Parent

Greetings.

Luciole -

Hello, I'm Luciole, juggler and drawer:
https://www.facebook.com/les.couleurs.de.la.luciole/?timeline_context_item_type=intro_card_work&timeline_context_item_source=1473721202&pnref=lhc

I co-organize the : GRAÜLICH FIRE CONVENTION from 14th to 16th February and I want to post it this website.
https://www.facebook.com/events/1983133478605736/

Best regards.

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Welcome Luciole :)

For a second I thought it would be fun to go to a convention next week, but I suppose the events page is correct in saying that it takes place in September..?

Mïark - - Parent

Hi Luciole, welcome to Juggling Edge

You should add Graülich Fire Convention to the Juggling Edge Events Listings www.jugglingedge.com/events.php where more people will see it

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