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Cedric Lackpot -

What ever happened to ... ?

So, I found myself thinking about Jouni Temonen, a fabulous juggler from Finland who I met maybe a dozen or so years ago, and he's one of those really great jugglers who seems to have dropped completely off the radar. And I started wondering whether it's because he's doing better, more professional things, or perhaps he's got a proper job/life/baby or whatever and doesn't really inhabit the juggling world so much any more.

And then that got me thinking about Joost Dessing, and wondering what on earth he's up to now. And the more you think about it, the more gifted talents you will remember that seem to have disappeared off the scene for one reason or another.

So who do you recall, who was infuriatingly talented but has since moved on with their lives?

Mike Moore - - Parent

Maybe Michael Falkov. One of the best 3b jugglers ever (IMO, top 3, arguably the very top), but is super off-grid. Not sure if he's juggled in the last ~2 years.

Orinoco - - Parent

Reuben Cohn-Gordon, Arron Gregg & Anthony Gatto (obviously!) are the names who immediately spring to my mind.

Similarly, is it my imagination or is the 'lifetime' of a juggler getting shorter? For example I feel that the more recent BYJotY competitors have not remained as visible in the scene as the earlier competitors (Norbi, Tiff, Tom Derrick, Arron Sparks, Jon Udry, Matt Pang etc.). Has the increased average skill level & easier access to the 'next big thing' made staying in the community's consciousness harder? Has the top level of juggling reached the point where physical limits are being hit & injury is forcing people out sooner?

Mike Moore - - Parent

Oof, I definitely miss Reuben Cohn-Gordon. I had a brief chat with him May 2014 when I was getting into squeeze catches. At that point he implied that he was still juggling some. Maybe there's hope.

It's an interesting point about youngins not staying on the scene as long these days. I got curious about IJA juniors winners...and I wish I knew if more of them still juggled. Below are some of the winners and whether or not they still juggle (to my knowledge)

2005
Komei Aoki - Yes
Takashi Kikyo - Yes

2006
Tony Pezzo - YES
Billy Watson - ?

2007
Nate Martin - ?
Teruki Okamoto - I think so

2008
Ben Hestness - ?

2009
David Ferman - ?
Jack Levy - ?

2010
Noah Malone - Yes
David Ferman - ?
Lauge Benjaminsen - Yes

2011
David Ferman - ?
Jack Denger - ? (stopped making videos)
Patrick Fraser - Pretty much stopped

2012
Kellin Quinn - YES
Jack Denger - ?
Ashley Ellis - ?

2013
Ashley Ellis - ?

It's Him - - Parent

It seems to me that the number of people entering BYJOTY has reduced and that the average skill level is also less. Whether this is because the people attending BJC are getting older (and hence less youngsters are around to compete) or the general skill level is higher and so the good youngsters don't stand out so much or some other reason I couldn't say. Still at least a few of the recent winners are still very much on the scene and in the community consciousness. It was only about 4 years ago that Arthur Hyam won.

Nigel

peterbone - - Parent

As well as other things in life getting in the way, one thing I've noticed based mainly on myself and is that as you get older you tend to seek praise from others less. This is why we make juggling videos of ourselves. As I get older I'm juggling just as much but making far fewer videos. People therefore think I've stopped juggling. I was recently asked to film a section for a video about people who've stopped juggling!

Dee - - Parent

What Joost is up to is very easy to find [he is based in Queen's in Belfast]. His research seems to have veered towards football rather than juggling (probably related to sources of funding).

Monte - - Parent

I miss Brian, nobody does a 5 cheese showers like he did.

Little Paul - - Parent

You’ve just reminded me of “Charlie Cheese and the wheel of cheese!”

It’s cheeky as cheese Charlie!

LizzyPeat -

What insurance cover has your club got?
We are starting up the Newbury Juggling Club again (9th Jan 2018)
What insurance cover has your club got? How much money is it? What cover do you think is needed as a minimum?
We have no guidance from the school and I'm looking round for quotes.
Thanks!

LizzyPeat - - Parent

I should also say, the best quote we have had so far is from 'Ansvar Insurance' which includes Public & Products Liability at £1,000,000 (libel and slander cover at £10,000) for £69.20 for the year.

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Is this a thing in the UK? I know that every amateur juggling club in the Netherlands isn't insured...

Also, the first thing I thought when I read the post title is "Huh, it's only 25e to replace a pirouette, why would you want to insure them?" ;)

It's Him - - Parent

If your club is run by a person who is a member of Equity (costs around £130 p.a.) then they get £10m PLI automatically. However it might not be a good idea to advertise you have insurance as after seeing the dangerous things that Milton Keynes club has got up to over the last 25 years, you may not want to be the person going around saying "don't do that!". It might be better to supply new jugglers with a form to sign that states that you basically are hiring the hall and that anything stupid that the juggler does is entirely their responsibility.

Nigel

Alice - - Parent

We get our insurance from Showtime. We combine club and convention insurance as it is a little cheaper. Most standard policies are ,I believe, for up to 2 million. the school where we have the convention insist on 5 million which makes our insurance quite a bit more expensive. The quote you have sounds pretty good to me. As always you only know how good insurance is when you come to use it. Every year i email reiterating what we do,that the convention site is separate from the club etc just so I have something in writing in case of dispute.
I think clubs have to look at getting insurance,otherwise those running the clubs risk being personally liable for any claims. most university clubs have cover included as do some sports halls if you hire from them.
Alice

charlieh - - Parent

Ask Katie to ask the Camcircus committee, they'll know what we have. It's years since I knew what's current.

For those saying 'just get people to sign something' - this is a disclaimer, and these aren't really worth anything. You still need Public Liability Insurance to cover someone sueing your club if they get injured (bear in mind they may be the nicest person in the world but may still *have* to sue you if they get a life-altering injury - to provide medical care, or an income for the future).

Also, Equity PLI cover insures the person, not the club - so unless I'm running the Charlie Hull Juggling Club and I'm doing all the teaching it's not much use.

Yes, in a juggling world of people being known for amazing tricks and skills, one of my areas of knowledge is insurance. Sigh.

LizzyPeat - - Parent

Thank you all.

Little Paul -

Not strictly speaking juggling, but you're the sort of people who may be able to help.

I'm looking for a reliable UK supplier of qualatex 260q modelling balloons. We've ordered two batches recently from different sellers on amazon, the first sent us balloons with a best before date of 2013 (not great for a natural latex product, but I went with it at the time as it was only to amuse my nices/nephew - and I just put up with the high burst rate)

However, the more recent seller subbed in a different brand of balloons to that which was advertised. That sales are being dealt with via the appropriate returns procedure, but having bitten twice now, I want a reliable supplier with a reasonable enough turnover of stock that I'm not going to be shipped something that's 4 years past its best before date.

Ideally I want somewhere that carries stock of the single colours, but I'll take a standard entertainer mix.

Any ideas?

It's Him - - Parent

Do you have any mates in Bristol who are balloon modellers? Or do any of the local entertainers know a local balloon modeller? People who do it regularly tend to buy in large quantities (as it is quite a bit cheaper) e.g. I tend to buy 50 entertainers assortment bags per order (and occasionally some single colours as blues and pinks are more popular). This lasts me about 6 months and I don't do that much balloon modelling so someone who is much more into it will have a quicker turnover.

Nigel

Cedric Lackpot - - Parent

Last time I looked, which was quite a while ago, Pioneer were the UK distributors for Qualatex. They were always quick and efficient with me. Or I could just give you some.

Little Paul - - Parent

As far as I can tell Pioneer (or at least that particular Pioneer) are a US outfit, however it simply hadn't occurred to me to look for a list of distributors on the Qualatex website.

They list quite a few UK distributors (although unfortunately none in Bristol) so I might go down that route.

Cedric Lackpot - - Parent

Likewise, it didn't occur to me to examine my inbox for unread spam from the buggers. Graham Lee is the chap to speak to - graham@balloonchat.co.uk - or use his Qualatex addy - graham@qualatexballoons.co.uk

But I expect you're ahead of the curve by now.

Little Paul - - Parent

I’m all sorted now, thanks to you and Nigel for the help!

It's Him -

A totally biaised review of MKJC8

My role as part of MKJC has changed from main organiser to show booker so I was intending to actually see what happened at the convention this year. I did see a lot more but the day was more stressful than I had anticipated. Still it all turned out OK in the end.

On Friday evening I was running a quiz at the local museum, my mother who runs the tea shop at the museum had done the catering at the quiz and normally also does the scoring. During the day she had noticed that one of her fingers was getting larger and hotter, by half way through the quiz she needed to go to the local walk-in centre to have it looked at (my wife drove her there as she couldn't drive with the finger so swollen - it took 3 hours of waiting for them to spend less than 5 minutes looking at her and prescribing a course of anti-biotics - as of yesterday the swelling whilst somewhat reduced was still bad and painful). As a result of all this and getting in at 23:30 I didn't look at my emails until Saturday morning.

The first thing I noticed from my emails was one from our hat juggler, Georgie, saying that she had fallen down the stairs at work the day before and hurt her wrist and therefore wouldn't be in the show. This put us at 7 acts, only one of any length. That was possibly pushing it.

There wasn't a lot I could do at that point but get on with the things I had to do for the convention (which included bringing a large aerial rig and erecting it) due to various causes I finished that about 10:50 and then had to run a workshop at 11:00. I didn't have that many at my intermediate diabolo workshop but I think everyone who came learnt at least one new trick which is generally my aim. It was fun. I finished around 12:00 and went to see if any of my acts had arrived obviously bumping into a bunch of old friends along the way and so taking a while. I met up with Void who gave me a little run down on his kendama 6th dan achievement amongst other things. After a while I also met Matt the Devil-sticker who was sporting a couple of bruises around his eye and on his face. Apparently he had fallen off his bike about 4 days before and his whole left side was bruised. Obviously he wasn't going to be in the show. I was down to 6 acts. Fortunately I wasn't the main organiser, I could share the stress with Cory. After asking a few people Jonathan the Jester volunteered to help out and put on an act. He organised the whole act on the day and even bought the jacket at the event. He also helped run the games later on. He deserves a massive thank you from the whole team. He didn't deserve the flack he got from one attendee on a Facebook thread about what you liked and disliked about the convention (this message has since been deleted).

After lunch I gave Jamie Fletcher a whole bunch of rings that had been sitting in my garage for a while and he promised that he would get working on a Salerno ring for me. I then had to help take down the aerial rig. I did do a little bit of club juggling but it didn't last long as Greeny then appeared and I chatted to him. I also conversed with Kevin Fletcher who casually does great tricks on his unicycle and then protests it is nothing. I'm sorry but standing on one pedal on the side of the unicycle, hovering and then juggling back crosses is not nothing!

Sometime around three I met up with Jamie and Lizzie in the cafe and played three rounds of one game with them. I can't remember the name of the game but it has domino like tiles, all of which show types of land (wood, sea, plains etc) and some of which have crowns on them. That should be enough for someone else to identify it.

Around the start of the games I took the rig back to where it lives so that I could more easily fit everything else in my car later on ( I also had another rig and a sound system to transport but they were needed for the show). I got back in time to grab some pizza and then it was rehearsal time.

All the professional and experienced acts did their tech first and we slowly gathered up the 25 kids who were representing Concrete Circus this year. This is 10 more than the previous best. Their act comprised 6 sections which alternated between the slow and hopefully graceful with action sections. The rehearsal did not go well. At one point I learned that one of the sections of music we needed had been emailed to me that morning (after I had already left home) and as my phone has been discharging rapidly recently I had no power to get to my emails. This caused the sound man a lot of grief so well done Max who is only 13. The sound in the show may have had some problems but that was because we caused a number of them.

On to the show.

The compere Stevie Vegas is known to others as Steve Thomson. His routines were full of puns and he did a good job of working the audience.

First act as always was Concrete Circus, the act was titled 'Grace and Flavour' due to it's alternating nature. The first section was a 1,2 and 3 person aerial hoop piece that was well received. At the end of this we had to move the rig from the front of the stage and whilst we had rehearsed this we had used the stage manager as one of the people who was grabbing one of the legs. As he was trying to help with some of the sound problems we had caused he wasn't available so I had to ask a parent from out of the audience.

Second section was always going to be our most problematic as it involved 6 kids juggling and whilst mainly they weren't doing anything that difficult they don't tend to practice juggling for a sustained period but rather normally switch tricks fairly often so e.g. 2 minutes of club passing with people walking or cartwheeling through the pattern tends towards the droppy. The audience did get to witness a handspring 3 ball collect to juggle and our 11 year old juggler Max perform some of his longer routine including a finger fork catch, to under the leg throw to neck catch.

Third section was our s-staff and poi bit, this was much better co-ordinated than in practice. If anyone has tried to herd cats then you might try comparing it to getting kids to stay in time with each other.

Next we had the walking globe routine with 3 kids aged 9 or 10. They performed several tricks on the walking globe (only one out of order) and managed to finish in time with the music (which was 'In the hall of the Mountain King') which is really tough to do.

In the penultimate section we had 2 girls dancing on stilts. The music cut off just before the finish because of a misinterpreted cue but that didn't make much difference and as the dance stops with both girls sitting on the floor the audience got to witness getting up without the use of walls, helpers or anything other than skill.

The last section featured 8 unicyclists performing various tricks to 'The Dambusters March'. Just before the finish we have two sets of 4 unicyclists going round in tight circles (holding on to a small hoop). They then all change direction at the same time. Many in the audience may have heard me cheer as this worked perfectly. In practice it had worked a total of twice in more than 40 attempts.

Second act was Julia (Jules) Cormack-Cooke. This was an excellent staff routine performed to a spoken word piece. Everything about this piece was great and you can tell I really enjoyed it. Jules will be working with Performers Without Borders next year and as a fund raising measure she will be hosting two cabaret shows, one at the wonderful Up the Creek in Greenwich, on Monday November 27th, the other at Etcetera Theatre in Camden, on Wednesday 29th.

Closing the first half was The Void. He performed his club routine which includes many fakes, many silly faces and some great skills. I thoroughly enjoyed it.

During the interval the raffle was held. When I bought my wristband in the morning I hadn't been asked if I wanted raffle tickets but was instead just charged for them. At the time I thought it would have been nice to be asked. As it was I was extremely grateful as I won the first prize (An adult BJC ticket). I've already booked our places at the BJC but I'm sure I can either sell this on or claim the money back.

Starting the second half was Jonathan the Jester and some of Wessex Circus and friend. Jonathan told a short story about having his hair cut and how it impacted his son. This was one of the funniest stories I have ever heard him tell. He did his old routine of getting a kid to stand on his shoulder, then got a couple of his youngsters to do some acrobatics. He got a couple of older youths (Adam and Chris?) to pass clubs whilst on walking globes, finishing with him having Adam on his shoulders whilst they passed clubs. This put Adam about the height of the top of the stage curtain but he coped admirably. Many thanks again Jonathan.

Matt Green is known for many routines but not ring juggling which was what he performed. This was a really nice new routine which was nearly dropless. It started with six rings, dropped down to three and gradually built back to five. When his music ran out it restarted which Matt wasn't expecting but he coped admirably. A really good piece.

I first saw the Robot act performed by Brook and Becky at Leeds convention last year. I immediately asked Brook if he would like to perform it at MKJC. After getting Becky to agree they confirmed and it was exactly as good as I expected. Even though there were many more height issues than elsewhere. It isn't apparent to the audience that there are beams and light bars that go across the top of the stage and these get in the way. There are only a few places you can stand and not hit them and it is much harder for a passing act. I saw Becky recover at least one throw that had clearly hit something. The act as always combined high skill and comedy.

Finally or should that be finale was Matt Hennem. He performed his mime/dance contact routine. I haven't got tired of watching it and this is the third time I've seen it performed this year. We get a lot of people in the audience who don't go to other conventions and they were really wowed by it.

Can I thank everyone who took part in the show and everyone who ran the event especially Cory Bond. Even with the stress it was still the easiest MKJC for me of the lot.

Nigel

JonPeat - - Parent

Did you have any breakfast on Saturday morning?
What did you have for lunch?
What flavour pizza did you have in the evening?

Jokes aside, thank you for your review! ;-)
I was sorry to miss the convention (first MKJC I have missed) and it was lovely to read a run down of the days events.
Cheers, Jon

It's Him - - Parent

Missed breakfast. Lunch was a cheddar cheese sandwich, a peanut butter sandwich, a pack of stilton flavour cheddars and a rocky bar. Pizza was texas barbecue meat feast and was delicious.

Not sure whether I will make it to Leeds on Saturday yet.

A run down of the days events might have included other workshops and the games but I missed most of that. My wife, Tracey, ran a how to teach beginners juggling workshop and attended a lasso workshop and progressed to above the head. Other things happened of which I have no knowledge and which I will learn about over the next week or so. One review is never enough for an event but even one is better than nothing.

Nigel

The Void - - Parent

Cheers for the review, and the nice comment. Minor note: you seem to suggest Greeny was in the second half, but he was in the first half, after Jules.
Meanwhile, photos.... Wait, was that *you* with the bloody flash?!?!

It's Him - - Parent

As most of the photos are quite dark no flash was used for them but I did try and get the odd photo with flash so I had a picture for the DVD which you will get for free being in the show. I also was told to use flash at the very start so that we could sync all the video. I probably did annoy you with flash at some point but not often compared to the 30+ photos I have of you.

When I wrote the review I was struggling with sleep deprivation and couldn't remember which half Greeny was in. When looking at my photos it was obvious but you can't edit posts on JugglingEdge and I didn't actually say when he appeared but rather implied he was second half.

Nigel

LizzyPeat - - Parent

That game you mention is called 'Kingdomino' Nigel, our current favourite game.
Also, may I say that keeping your rings in an old record box is a very bright and sparkling idea.
A good review, I would add that The Auction was seriously good as well, I got a pashley unicycle sort of accidentally- I think £25 is still far too cheap.
The lady who kept outbidding herself was particularly good value for money.

It's Him - - Parent

Hi Lizzy,
I knew the name of the game shortly after I wrote the review. In fact I bought it the next week at Leeds along with Splendour which we have also enjoyed. I can't claim the idea of keeping rings in LP cases as it came from Barney Bay (Barney Maunder-Taylor) as did the rings.

Nigel

It's Him -

So tomorrow is MKJC8. It looks like it might be fairly miserable driving there but that it will be brightening early afternoon and dry for the rest of the day/night.

The convention starts at 10 am with workshops starting at 11 am. I'm going to be running an intermediate old school one diabolo workshop that concentrates on knots and around the arm/leg moves. Anyone who is old enough will probably remember all these tricks but hopefully someone will get something from it.

The catering from previous years (apart from last year) will be back again.

Games will be at 4 pm and as I have read that Jon Peat will not be there this year other people have a chance at the endurance events.

The show will be approximately 7 pm - 9pm and the line-up (not in order) includes:

Matthew Green,

Concrete Circus,

The Void,

Georgie Price,

Jules Cooke,

Matt Hennem,

Brook and Becky

and Matt the Devil Sticker from Corby (sorry don't currently know his surname)

The compere would like to be known as Stevie Vegas.

I hope to see as many of you as possible and as I have very few things to do during the day I also hope to actually enjoy the convention.

Nigel

#MKJC8

The Void - - Parent

I had fun yesterday. Got there probably too early, but lots of time for chatting, mooching about and drinking coffee with friends. I even played a little kendama. It was good fun being in the show (thanks for the nice comments, those who gave them), and I really enjoyed seeing Brook & Becky's act that I'd heard good things of, and meeting up with my old friend Matt Hennem, and seeing him do his wiggly thing again. :-) Mucking about with Greeny in the curtain call was top silly fun too.
I was very confused by Matt asking me which day I'd arrived on. Apparently, if you're not careful, you can misconstrue "MKJC8 - 11th November" as "MJKC, 8-11 November". LOL.
Cheers to all the MKJC crew.
http://tlmb.net/galleries/MKJC2017/

It's Him - - Parent

Glad you enjoyed it. It was good to see your act again. When I go through my photos tomorrow I hope I will have got some of the faces you pulled in the show. it's a shame that we didn't have Jon Peat there to write a review I wonder if anyone else will do it.

Nigel

Scott Seltzer - - Parent

eJuggle happily posts fest reviews from others besides Jon. Be in touch with me to contribute to eJuggle.

7b_wizard - - Parent

Void pulls faces?

It's Him - - Parent

I put 3 photos on this page to give you an idea https://www.facebook.com/events/125838554740265/ I apologise for the quality of the photos, these are cropped from slightly less poor quality photos but I wasn't really concentrating on the photography as I only really wanted one photo per act for the DVD cover. As it is I didn't get one for Concrete Circus being peripherally involved with the act.

Nigel

7b_wizard - - Parent

Thank you for taking me serious.

It's Him - - Parent

I always take everything to do with The Void seriously! :-)

Nigel

7b_wizard -

What's the longest toss-juggling endurance you ever did?

(no matter which pattern, which prop)

  1. I don't really endure anything
  2. less than a minute
  3. between 1 and 3 min
  4. between 3 and 5 min
  5. between 5 and 10 min
  6. between 10 and 30 min
  7. between 30 min and 1 h
  8. between 1 and 4 h
  9. marathon, more than 4 h


I hope to find - if many of us vote - how popular or common enduring even is (and for how long).

This is a competition thread which ran from 9th Nov 2017 to 16th Nov 2017. View results.

It's Him - - Parent

About 25 years ago I worked for a juggling stall that had a competition which was to juggle 3 x 1.5 Kg Splats as long as possible. I think the winner was about 45 minutes. Shortly after that I tried to match that time with 3 x 1 Kg Absolutes. I matched it but killed my wrists doing it and suffered from tendonitis for quite a while. I'm not sure that endurance is necessarily the way to go but it made for an interesting competition.

Nigel

Daniel Simu - - Parent

What are Splats and Absolutes? I know Absolute rings but they are definitely not 1kg :p

The Void - - Parent

Big beanbags.

Ameron Rosvall - - Parent

Sounds very painful, can kinda relate, though what you did must have been worse. I did 3 beanbags with wrist weights for 1 hour once, beanbags were just 200g each and weights were 1.5kg each. Still very exhausting.

Mike Moore - - Parent

Longest endurances have been my worst dropless joggling races

Maria - - Parent

I did my longest endurance when I had only juggled for two years. It was 20 minutes of 3 clubs cascade. I'm not planning on doing any longer endurance of any pattern.

7b_wizard - - Parent

°oupps° .. a logical inconsistency in the poll again: ..ever did? versus 1. ..don't really now..

Please read ( 1. I don't really endure anything ) as "1. I never really endured anything."!

Maria - - Parent

That is how I understood it.
I was thinking, though... If you want to find out how popular endurance is, it might also be interesting to know if people are planning/hoping to achieve longer runs in the future, and how long. I have no desire to spend a lot of time trying to get as long runs as possible any more, but I would like to be able to do patterns for, like, 5 minutes or something. But I guess that wouldn't really count as endurance, it would more be about getting the pattern really solid.

7b_wizard - - Parent

I'm not planning to do anything longer than my 3b 12 minutes. Yes, especially for important basic patterns, 5 minutes is pretty much okay for me too. Yet, with 5 min x 60 sec x ~5~6 throws/sec = ~1,500 throws, that I got near to once only with 5 balls, I still don't feel like really having ``mastered´´ the pattern, it's far from ``like walking´´. So either I'll have to get more runs over 1,000 or indeed do many more throws and minutes. But it's sooo time intensive while learning tricks and other patterns instead is much more rewarding (and hard and challenging enough and worthwhile too).

Maria - - Parent

I have not been close to 5 minutes with any other pattern than 3 objects cascade yet. Could probably do it with a basic passing pattern with the right partner (6 clubs 4-count, 2-count or 3-count). Solo patterns... maybe 423 could work.
I'm definitely not even close with 4 objects, my personal record being just a little bit over 200 catches. But that might actually be a bit of an endurance thing, I do get tired when juggling 4 clubs. Arms starting to get tired before 100 catches, and my pulse is definitely high, too.

Yeah, it's more fun to learn new tricks and patterns than spending lots of time on the ones that already kind of works.

7b_wizard - - Parent

Mine was 12+ minutes of 3b cascade.

Daniel Simu - - Parent

2360c of 5b. that would be about 10m I suppose

pumpkineater23 - - Parent

1 - 3 minutes..

Marvin - - Parent

This poll has now ended. The results are:

  1.   I don't really endure anything (0 votes)
  2.   less than a minute (0 votes)
  3.   between 1 and 3 min (1 vote)
  4.   between 3 and 5 min (1 vote)
  5.   between 5 and 10 min (4 votes)
  6.   between 10 and 30 min (8 votes)
  7.   between 30 min and 1 h (6 votes)
  8.   between 1 and 4 h (2 votes)
  9.   marathon, more than 4 h (0 votes)

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Ey Marvin, I know I could easily add up the numbers myself, but would you consider posting the total amount of votes next time as well? (22 this time)
If you're interested, you could even go as far as showing the percentage of voters that voted for a particular option. (36% voted for nr6)

Marvin - - Parent

Yes, I can include the total number of votes cast. Totting up a few tiny integers for you is an excellent use of my mental capacity. Do you find percentages useful when the total votes is considerably under 100?

And no, I have never been interested in any of these polls.

Monte - - Parent

Here I am, brain the size of a planet. Count they tell me. Call that job satisfaction,'cause I don't.

Daniel Simu - - Parent

It's not so much about a percentage as it is about quickly seeing that about one third of the voters voted for number 6, which is not easy to see right now. Of course, as a statistic it is near meaningless with such few participants.

DavidCain -

I thought that there might be a number here who would find this article interesting.
https://www.juggle.org/birds-tree-trick/
David Cain

The Void - - Parent

At least one. Thanks.

7b_wizard - - Parent

Nice read, nice watch.

Little Paul - - Parent

Damn you. Now I have to learn that.

There goes the next year of my life

It's Him - - Parent

Learn it Paul so that I don't have to!

Nigel

Little Paul - - Parent

Race you

It's Him - - Parent

This is actually a project I think should be fairly doable. Let us set some criteria and we can certainly make this a race. How many birds being the first criteria, 5 like David or should we go for a more tree like structure? I can see that anything behind the balance would be a bugger to hit. Are we restricting size of weapon launcher? Is there any restrictions on weaponry? I was thinking of using nerf bullets as I have a bunch and they should be easy to use and safe for an audience. Anything else?

Nigel

Little Paul - - Parent

In my head, I'm making the structure out of PVC plumbing pipe, because it's cheap and easy to work with (and fairly easy to break down for storage/transport)

Details I've not worked out in my head:
* What to make the birds out of - David, I like the look of yours, what are they made from?
* How many to go for - 5 seems like it might be a nice number. 3 doesn't seem like enough, 7 seems like too many, even numbers are invalid
* Size of weapon launcher "don't take the piss" - if it's long enough that the end is only 1" away from the easiest bird that's too long.

In terms of ammunition, I'm not sure. I have access to plenty of nerf darts, but in my head it should be a proper "peashooter" - but then by the same measure it appears to be terribly difficult to obtain a traditional peashooter on amazon/ebay

The nerf solution would be more visual, safer, easier to clear up etc, so is probably more practical.

All in, it looks like a much easier trick to get a handle on than that damn candle trick.

It's Him - - Parent

I am looking at 4 ltr milk bottles as a suitable substance for the birds. I did like the ones David had but wasn't sure whether he just artistic or he found something suitable. I'm not sure whether to go for a thinner, wooden construction rather than pipe. I also need to spend a lot more time on a forehead balance as I normally chin balance. I'll see what I can cobble together and where that takes us. I'm thinking either Bath or BJC next year for the results to be shown. I will definitely be at BJC but Bath is dependant on work.

Nigel

Little Paul - - Parent

I’m a habitual chin/nose balancer (for everything other than the golf club trick obviously) so I think the forehead thing is going to need work too.

I went to juggling tonight for some forehead balance practice, and I’m so out of shape at the moment my knees started playing up.

It did strike me though, this is the ideal time of year to start working on this trick, what with fake trees being available at reasonably low cost in all the shops at the moment...

It's Him - - Parent

Yesterday I went to B&Q and picked up a tree for £4 and some of the cups that furniture coasters sit on (4 for £2.90). I now need to mutilate the tree and do some drilling as well as make some plastic birds. On Wednesday head balance practice was 30 - 60 seconds on my best attempts (as opposed to multiple minutes on a chin balance). So this is definitely a long term project even though it seemed simple in scope.

Nigel

Little Paul - - Parent

Last nights juggling session was somewhat diverted by the arrival of a rather splendid book about the history of juggling - so I only got a small amount of practice in.

I too am struggling with the forehead balance (the whole thing is the wrong side of my glasses and out of focus) and my best is also in the 30-60s range.

Its going to take more than one session per week to dial this in.

I have a nerf blowpipe on order...

It's Him - - Parent

On Saturday at Leeds convention I let a few people have a go at shooting my practice bird off of a club using a straw launched nerf bullet. The ones with the solid balance unsurprisingly did best. Whilst the straw works it isn't an elegant solution so I will be experimenting with a better launcher soon. Practice tomorrow is going to be all forehead balance although I may work on the tree as well just to see how much difference that makes to just using a club. Fortunately I have a few days before the busy period really kicks in.

Nigel

It's Him - - Parent

Having had another play with club and bird yesterday evening, it was much easier balancing the club on the forehead with the bird's wing sticking forward. In fact it was so much easier I managed to shoot the bird off the club (but lost the balance afterwards) a couple of times. This suggests to me that the top bird should be the last one shot off. Today I plan on building my first tree and hopefully get some more birds made.

Nigel

Orinoco - - Parent

I feel the world needs to see two performers facing off on a Renegade stage trying to shoot each others' birds.

DavidCain - - Parent

Hello Gentlemen. The birds I used were just sketches of birds printed on card stock with one half of a table tennis ball taped to the bottom of each, so that they could perch on their "nests". I truly think the easiest way to do it is to get a golf umbrella, remove the nylon fabric, and use the metal arms as the branches. Print out the birds on card stock, bend them down the middle, and put them on the branches. A nerf blow gun or even cheaper alternative works just fine. If you want me to send you a word document with the bird sketch, just let me know the email address to send it to. I'm glad I've been able to resurrect such a fun and completely silly trick.
David

It's Him - - Parent

Hi David,

Can you please send me that sketch to (my name)AT its him dotcodotuk (no spaces or capitals in there)

Nigel

DavidCain - - Parent

Here's a link for anyone to get the bird sketch. I should have just done this in the first place.
http://historicaljugglingprops.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/Bird.jpg

Orinoco - - Parent

I'm guessing that's not to scale. What's the wingspan of your finished birds?

DavidCain - - Parent

21.5 cm

Orinoco - - Parent

Thanks. In which case printing this pdf document onto A4 should result in a suitable sized bird.

Mike Moore -

Activities to keep new jugglers interested at club

I'm considering making some kind of resource of many fun tricks/patterns/games that:

1) Do not require high technical skill (3b cascade is sufficient)
2) Result in the building of skills that are likely to be useful in future juggling
3) ARE FUN

This is inspired by an old workshop handout from Mr E. called 3 Ball Fun With Others, presented at the 2011 IJA.

What are some activities that were fun for you when you were learning to juggle? What are some you've encountered, or thought of since? Interested in individual, newbie-newbie, and newbie-oldie (and with more people, if you have them!) activities.

(I'm aware of the importance of non-juggling things to keep people interested, but that's not what I'm focused on at the moment.)

Orinoco - - Parent

The Circle Game!!!

Mike Moore - - Parent

Oooo, wonderful! Thanks!

7b_wizard - - Parent

Bothhand passing large e.g. soccer or basket or volley balls .. a 2 people 2 ball or 3b bothhanded shower or 3b bothhanded cascade ?

7b_wizard - - Parent

Have a lot there to discover: all kinds 'a props, ropes, sticks, lasso, cups, PET bottles to spin into stance, anything. a throw-heights-relations-poster (or drawing) on the wall. an internet connection. a shelf with a few juggling books. big stuff like a rack, big cases, a trampoline, a walking globe.

Mike Moore - - Parent

Do you think there is an optimal time to start teaching different props? It would be a dedicated effort (not a "Hey, what's that?) because our club tends to stick with balls rings clubs poi flowersticks diabolo.

7b_wizard - - Parent

I'm afraid, I have no idea (maybe s.o. else). I was just thinking of beginners who were for the moment ``done´´ with balls and learning the cascade, soas there would be lots of other things to explore.

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Finish your sessions as a group with some long (3-5m) endurances! If you drop, pick up and get back in the pattern ASAP. People pick any pattern based on their own skill level.

standard 3b with 4 hands juggling, but back to back

Sitting, rolling down clubs from your knees. getting 5 clubs to roll in a cascade isn't too hard, 3 is super easy and 7 is a fun challenge (which can be mastered in one or two sessions)

If I teach workshops to adults, I get them to try ass catches. Can't go wrong with those

Frisbeeing 3 rings at once stacked like a fan for a partner to catch on arm-head-arm

One of my favorite passing patterns, which can be joined by people who are able to exchange 2 clubs ( 330 ), is the carousell. It requires at least like 4-5 jugglers, it gets more comfortable with 6-7+. With half of them okay jugglers and at least one good one it's not hard to get this running:
One juggler stands on one side (6m free space behind and beside him), runners form a row on the other side. All runners except the outer right one (from runners point of view) will hold 2 clubs, outer right holds 3. Juggler also holds 3. Outer runner(runner 1) and juggler make a pass at the same time, but juggler passes to runner 2. Runner 1 leaves the line, runs behind the other runners and joins them on the left side. Runner 2 receives L, makes one self, and another pass, while juggler passes (in 2count) already to runner 3.
All the runners hold 2 clubs, wait for their one "receive, self, pass", and then run behind to the other end of the line, making them turn in a circle around the juggler and in a circle around each other. Juggler continuously passes in 2 count, but always to the person next to the one from which he/she receives the pass.
It's easy to get it to work once the runners understand "receive, self, pass", and the runners have a lot of time to pick up dropped clubs. If the juggler drops, you can work out how runners can sacrifice their clubs by making a pass even though they haven't received (juggler skips a runner) so that the pattern can keep on going.

Phew, I hope that makes sense, there is probably an easier way to explain this. Like, me acting it out when I'm in your gym...

Mike Moore - - Parent

Hmm, I hadn't even considered the effect of our meetings not having a specific ending time. They're always a "Come around 5:30, juggle until you don't want to anymore". That said, having a particular time for endurance games could be good!

I think the priming by Orin's post made your description very easy to understand[1]. We could of course do a carousell with balls, too!

[1] But still come visit if you're ever in Ontario

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Fly me over with the perfomance budget of your nearest convention, and I'll stick around to teach some mass passing :p

7b_wizard - - Parent

blow up a silk-hanky with accu-hand-fan, max three blowers per re-blow-up, then they step back. upto two hankies per group ?

bad1dobby - - Parent

Two-person-five-object passing is a great way to get 2 people juggling together, while being easier than standard passing.
Juggler A always throws straight (ie. R hand throw to partners L hand) Juggler B always throws diagonally (ie. R hand throw to partners R hand). The pattern goes A-R B-L A-L B-R. Get the better juggler to do the straight throws, as the diagonal throws are easier.

Basic takeouts are a good fun extension of 3 ball juggling for two people. There is the challenge of maintaining a cascade-with-a-hole for the juggler, and the challenge of timing the steals and replacements for the stealer.

Learning to spin 2 rings in opposite directions on the arm is another thing that's easy to explain, not too difficult (and not too easy) to achieve, and readily leads to other ideas.

Mike Moore - - Parent

Ah, I think you've outlined nicely some new metrics for value in your last suggestion. I recall there being a trick like that in the Encyclopaedia, too. Thanks!

It's Him - - Parent

As a fairly easy starter game that enhances juggling skills and is fun, volley ball, as opposed to volley club, is much simpler and only really requires you to be able to juggle for a few throws. Games that work well with kids and that might work well with adults include Simon Says, 3 ball Combat and even things like 'What's the time Mr Wolf?',

Running a youth circus group, the things that they learn quickest are all the balance skills (stilts, walking globe, unicycle and tightrope), diabolo and hula hoop. They also enjoy staff, poi and levi stick but it helps if you have someone around who can do more than just the basic tricks.

Nigel

Mike Moore - - Parent

Ah, never thought of some of those! I think British Bulldog might also be fun.

Mïark - - Parent

Wouldn't British Bulldog be a non-juggling game? Or do you propose to make people juggle while they run across avoiding being flattened?

Mike Moore - - Parent

Replace "flattened" with "made to stop juggling in a gentle way" and you've got it.

It's Him -

I have just read on the Belfast Community Circus Facebook page about the passing of Will Chamberlain.

Some of you will remember him as being part of the organising team of BJC Norwich in 1995. I knew him more recently as we were both directors of the youth circus organisation CircusWorks and was impressed with his humour and deep knowledge of organisational matters.

My thoughts are with his family at this time.

Nigel

It's Him -

Congratulations to the Void!

I have just read on a Facebook post from Donald Grant that he has passed his 6th Dan Kendama exam. this is the highest level and he has become the first ever non-Japanese to manage it. I know that he has had several attempts beforehand and that it had proved elusive even though all the individual skills were doable. So many congratulations on his perseverance.

Nigel

It's Him - - Parent

Apologies for the uncapitalised 't' at the start of a sentence. Just goes to show I should read my posts more thoroughly before hitting the post button.

Nigel

The Void - - Parent

Thank you, Nigel. I'll even forgive you the "t".

I wrote a Twitter thread about it, that starts here:
Today I became the first non-Japanese player to pass the highest grade of 6th Dan in kendama. It's the hardest thing I've ever done. 1/- pic.twitter.com/SdzusdcqQn
— The Void (@TheVoidTLMB) October 14, 2017

Scott Seltzer - - Parent

Mazal tov from Israel.

lukeburrage - - Parent

This is really cool. Congrats.

Is there an easy to read list of the tricks you needed to do, with video links?

Thanar - - Parent

I don't know enough about kendama to be sure, but this video claims to show all the tricks for 6th Dan in kendama: https://youtu.be/Yx47Uh6OfQo

The Void - - Parent

Hi Luke,
Thank you.
http://kendama.co.uk/tricks.html lists them all, with gifs, if that will do you. Right hand column of the Advanced/Dan table will show you how many of each one I had to do successfully in 10 attempts. (Plus, of course, having previously done all the stuff to get to 5th Dan, and then wait a year before being allowed to try.)

lukeburrage - - Parent

Yes, the list is good and the rules are clear. The gifs make my eyes bleed though, so the video was highly appreciated.

The Void - - Parent

If you want to read the long* story, it’s at http://kendama.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,3098.msg29896.html#msg29896 (after the tweets).

* Don’t say I didn’t warn you.

Orinoco - - Parent

That was a great read thank you. The story is always much more interesting than just the bare facts. All the more satisfying to learn that your achievement was in spite of sub-optimal conditions.


* As ever I disagree with the insinuation that 'long' equals 'bad'.

bad1dobby - - Parent

Well done Void! First in the world is a helluva thing!

I enjoyed the 'long' read.

The Void - - Parent

Thank you. But it's far from "first in the world". There are ~30-40 extant Japanese 6th Dan players. But I'll take it. :-)

bad1dobby - - Parent

Yes, fair point. I actually meant first non-Japanese in the world, as per OP, but now you've got me thinking about it I see that doesn't really make a whole lot of sense.

How about this: Congrats Void! Approximately 41st in the world is a helluva thing!

The Void - - Parent

I'll take it! :-)

7b_wizard - - Parent

I go along with that.
On foreign terrain it's so much the better an achievement as the natives always have an edge or two with a long tradition an' all on their side. On a side note, as a halfway decent chess player (over 50% on club level), I had been into Chinese Chess, Xiangqi, for a while, and the natives (real-life and online play) gave me a hard time to even win one game and leave rookie level, while I could win games against germans or other longnoses. However.
Congrats, The Void!

Kelhoon - - Parent

Congrats Void, well done

Monte - - Parent

Well done mate. I didn't even know you were trying again this year. Is that it now or can you go even higher?

The Void - - Parent

Cheers. It's the tops, it's the Colosseum. :)

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