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Alice -

Leeds Convention 18/11/17
Two days to go. The donuts are ordered, the tea awaits hot water , and your cup, and the venue is ready to go.
Same venue as the last 5 years large gym hall all day with adjoining classroom for tea and coffee , evening show brought to you by the organisers of CATCH convention.
Lazy Juggler are braving The South and Oddballs the North to trade on the day. Both traders happy to accept pre orders
Magnificent raffle prizes (Thank you BJC Canterbury) , workshops all day and games with seasonal prizes on offer.
Also a combat tournament ,which you will have to ask the young people about .
Looking forward to seeing you all there.
Alice

Mïark - - Parent

Doughnuts

#LJC17

John R - - Parent

The three-dimensional manifold whose boundary is a torus is a doughnut*. The ball with a sweet filling of some kind is a donut. Or maybe the other way round.

* More than a hundred years of topology and there is still no single word for the object that is to torus as ball is to sphere. Any suggestions?

The Void - - Parent

That's quoit difficult to answer.

Little Paul - - Parent

I like the word “quoit” - it has a nice ring to it

Orinoco - - Parent

*groans*

I hoop this doesn't get out of hand.

Little Paul - - Parent

Halo Orinoco! Nice to see you in a pun thread.



Cheerio again!

Alice - - Parent

This debate was had online some years ago. I also used to use "doughnuts" but was told by an English teacher than language always changes and we update it over time according to popular usage, which is probably why we no longer talk like in Ye olde days.

Anyway thanks to everyone who came to the convention, special thanks to Oddballs and Lazy Juggler, esp Oddballs who had a 10+ hour round trip. Also to our fantastic team from Hullabaloo , especially Jon who did most things and Rosie for the excellent show.
We very much hope to do it all again next year
Alice

Colin E. - - Parent

I love the way the doughnut theme is still running. I honestly can't remember how we came up with that one or when it started. I have a feeling the thought process was little more than "we like doughnuts, let's use the juggling convention as an excuse to buy them by the trayful!"

mike.armstrong - - Parent

My memory (which may be wrong!) is that we were offered a tea urn by the Students' Union when we hired the room. That inspired us to go looking for snacks to go with the drinks. I definitely remember walking round Morrisons with Helen Fitt looking for the best value items and deciding on the doughnuts.
I found a load of paperwork from the 2001 convention the other day; we ordered 500 doughnuts and paid £45!

Alice - - Parent

200 donuts/doughnuts not only cost £20, in the 7 years I have been running the convention this is the only overhead not to go up in price.
Its no wonder we have an obesity crisis, they do taste nice though!

mike.armstrong - - Parent

...and I'm pretty confident it started in 1999. Our first one (1998) was egg themed but I think we settled on doughnuts after that

Mïark - - Parent

The Basil t-shirt was 1999 and that has a doughnut on it

and 1998 was the Leeds University Juggling Egg-stravaganza

Little Paul - - Parent

I found my basil tshirt on the weekend, and I looked at it and wished I had been able to make it :(

Cedric Lackpot -

Shaker cups - how it should be done.

https://gfycat.com/NearEnergeticCowrie

Found over at /r/flippyshit along with all manner of other eye-boggling athletic stuff.

7b_wizard - - Parent

Goodness! .. doesn't that violate gravity?

Little Paul - - Parent

By “how it should be done” do you mean as a gif with no sound?

Cedric Lackpot - - Parent

SHAKER. CUPS. FTW. MOFO!!

Btw, I don't suppose you saw the splendid retro wrestling clip from /r/flippyshit? It's worth it just for the potty sound effects :-

https://youtu.be/cenS5gpiHPo

So we know that those wrestling rings are somewhat padded, but that 4m jump into a 1.5 front flip landing what is essentially a crash dive (old trampolining term, dunno what it would be in other disciplines) is fucking mental. Look for it at 0:39.

DavidCain -

I thought that there might be a number here who would find this article interesting.
https://www.juggle.org/birds-tree-trick/
David Cain

The Void - - Parent

At least one. Thanks.

7b_wizard - - Parent

Nice read, nice watch.

Little Paul - - Parent

Damn you. Now I have to learn that.

There goes the next year of my life

It's Him - - Parent

Learn it Paul so that I don't have to!

Nigel

Little Paul - - Parent

Race you

It's Him - - Parent

This is actually a project I think should be fairly doable. Let us set some criteria and we can certainly make this a race. How many birds being the first criteria, 5 like David or should we go for a more tree like structure? I can see that anything behind the balance would be a bugger to hit. Are we restricting size of weapon launcher? Is there any restrictions on weaponry? I was thinking of using nerf bullets as I have a bunch and they should be easy to use and safe for an audience. Anything else?

Nigel

Little Paul - - Parent

In my head, I'm making the structure out of PVC plumbing pipe, because it's cheap and easy to work with (and fairly easy to break down for storage/transport)

Details I've not worked out in my head:
* What to make the birds out of - David, I like the look of yours, what are they made from?
* How many to go for - 5 seems like it might be a nice number. 3 doesn't seem like enough, 7 seems like too many, even numbers are invalid
* Size of weapon launcher "don't take the piss" - if it's long enough that the end is only 1" away from the easiest bird that's too long.

In terms of ammunition, I'm not sure. I have access to plenty of nerf darts, but in my head it should be a proper "peashooter" - but then by the same measure it appears to be terribly difficult to obtain a traditional peashooter on amazon/ebay

The nerf solution would be more visual, safer, easier to clear up etc, so is probably more practical.

All in, it looks like a much easier trick to get a handle on than that damn candle trick.

It's Him - - Parent

I am looking at 4 ltr milk bottles as a suitable substance for the birds. I did like the ones David had but wasn't sure whether he just artistic or he found something suitable. I'm not sure whether to go for a thinner, wooden construction rather than pipe. I also need to spend a lot more time on a forehead balance as I normally chin balance. I'll see what I can cobble together and where that takes us. I'm thinking either Bath or BJC next year for the results to be shown. I will definitely be at BJC but Bath is dependant on work.

Nigel

Little Paul - - Parent

I’m a habitual chin/nose balancer (for everything other than the golf club trick obviously) so I think the forehead thing is going to need work too.

I went to juggling tonight for some forehead balance practice, and I’m so out of shape at the moment my knees started playing up.

It did strike me though, this is the ideal time of year to start working on this trick, what with fake trees being available at reasonably low cost in all the shops at the moment...

It's Him - - Parent

Yesterday I went to B&Q and picked up a tree for £4 and some of the cups that furniture coasters sit on (4 for £2.90). I now need to mutilate the tree and do some drilling as well as make some plastic birds. On Wednesday head balance practice was 30 - 60 seconds on my best attempts (as opposed to multiple minutes on a chin balance). So this is definitely a long term project even though it seemed simple in scope.

Nigel

Little Paul - - Parent

Last nights juggling session was somewhat diverted by the arrival of a rather splendid book about the history of juggling - so I only got a small amount of practice in.

I too am struggling with the forehead balance (the whole thing is the wrong side of my glasses and out of focus) and my best is also in the 30-60s range.

Its going to take more than one session per week to dial this in.

I have a nerf blowpipe on order...

It's Him - - Parent

On Saturday at Leeds convention I let a few people have a go at shooting my practice bird off of a club using a straw launched nerf bullet. The ones with the solid balance unsurprisingly did best. Whilst the straw works it isn't an elegant solution so I will be experimenting with a better launcher soon. Practice tomorrow is going to be all forehead balance although I may work on the tree as well just to see how much difference that makes to just using a club. Fortunately I have a few days before the busy period really kicks in.

Nigel

Orinoco - - Parent

I feel the world needs to see two performers facing off on a Renegade stage trying to shoot each others' birds.

DavidCain - - Parent

Hello Gentlemen. The birds I used were just sketches of birds printed on card stock with one half of a table tennis ball taped to the bottom of each, so that they could perch on their "nests". I truly think the easiest way to do it is to get a golf umbrella, remove the nylon fabric, and use the metal arms as the branches. Print out the birds on card stock, bend them down the middle, and put them on the branches. A nerf blow gun or even cheaper alternative works just fine. If you want me to send you a word document with the bird sketch, just let me know the email address to send it to. I'm glad I've been able to resurrect such a fun and completely silly trick.
David

It's Him - - Parent

Hi David,

Can you please send me that sketch to (my name)AT its him dotcodotuk (no spaces or capitals in there)

Nigel

DavidCain - - Parent

Here's a link for anyone to get the bird sketch. I should have just done this in the first place.
http://historicaljugglingprops.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/Bird.jpg

Orinoco - - Parent

I'm guessing that's not to scale. What's the wingspan of your finished birds?

DavidCain - - Parent

21.5 cm

Orinoco - - Parent

Thanks. In which case printing this pdf document onto A4 should result in a suitable sized bird.

Daniel Simu -

Not all juggling, but I wanted to share what I've been up to with you guys any way. I hope you enjoy this quick promo video :)

https://youtu.be/jm00mrnaDrk

bad1dobby - - Parent

Nice 'feet hook' in the table routine - is that your own invention? I'm familiar with the move a la Swing Bros, but I've not seen it done by both together.

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Funny that you mention the table routine, which is fairly common. The ladder routine on the contrary is completely original, as far as we are aware nobody has ever worked with that kind of structure!

I checked with my partner Berl, but he doesn't remember if he invented it (with his previous partner Thijs) or if he took it from somewhere. They were mostly self thought, so I'd say there is a good chance they made it up, but it isn't too hard so wouldn't more people have made it up too?

bad1dobby - - Parent

What can I say? New moves excite me more than new apparatus. ;) I'd love to see your ladder routine though.

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Secret link for underground community coming up:

https://youtu.be/l6Q91M46uYI

bad1dobby - - Parent

Nice! The see-saw is an excellent addition to the genre.

Not sure if you're looking for feedback. I had a couple of thoughts - I'll drop them in an email.

Daniel Simu - - Parent

I'm still waiting for your email :p

Dee - - Parent

I really enjoyed that. Perhaps not as much as some of the children, they were properly "into it".

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Thanks Dee! I wouldn't expect anyone watching the video to get really "into it", it's a thing best seen live. If the adults are not going to laugh about us, they will laugh about the children falling over the edge of the ring, making sure that everyone gets "it" in the end ;)

Little Paul - - Parent

I enjoyed that a lot

7b_wizard - - Parent

Wow! .. when it became dangerous, I watched mouth open like a 5yo.

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Thanks for all the responses guys, I hadn't expected so much encouragement on a juggling forum :p.

And yes, unlike many skills which I have performed, this one is as (or even more) dangerous as it looks, haha

7b_wizard - - Parent

Aside from admiring the high saults/jumps an' all, I particularly wondered if you don't clinch/clamp your hand between the two ladders when they clap together while you're holding onto one? Is there enough space in between or did you have to train to grip right in order to not pinch your hand?

7b_wizard - - Parent

*("saults/jumps") - STUNTS ! .. I wanted to say stunts!

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Which moment do you mean? In the seesaw finale? There is no moment when our hands are at risk

7b_wizard - - Parent

Meant 3:33, where you walk all over the whole seesaw and land in handstand on it, and also 3:59, always when the seesawing ladder claps on the standing part.

7b_wizard - - Parent

.. also 4:03. And it's rather Berl, I reckon.

Little Paul -

Anyone know if there’s a proposed date for chocfest yet? I can’t see anything in the events listing, but I’m trying to plan my January :)

Little Paul - - Parent

Damnit! Chocfest have just announced they’re going 20th jan - the one weekend I didn’t want them to go for :(

York Jugglers - - Parent

Sorry, we booked it straight after last Chocfest, but the someone else had already booked our preferred date so we had to go for a week earlier.

Does this mean you might not be coming Paul?

www.jugglingedge.com/event.php?EventID=4746

#chocfest23

Little Paul - - Parent

It means I definitely won’t be coming, I’m getting married instead - venue and registrar we’re booked this afternoon.

It also means some of my guest list will have to choose too :(

If only you had announced yesterday!

lukeburrage - - Parent

Congrats!

Mike Moore - - Parent

Wow! Congratulations!

Kelhoon - - Parent

congrats on the wedding, boo for the clashes

charlieh - - Parent

Yay! Congrats!

The Void - - Parent

Congrats to you both.

Orinoco - - Parent

Yay! Congratulations to you both!

Al_Bee - - Parent

Yay. Many congrats. Best wishes to you both. Have fun!

Bob Dilworth - - Parent

Congratulations, Paul. Great news!

bad1dobby - - Parent

Congrats LP!

Bob Dilworth -

Thanks for signing me up to this. I haven't been around the juggling 'scene' for a while although I do miss it and hope to show up at a convention or two soon.

I have recently decided that it is time a got finally got down to nailing 5 ball cascade before I get too old. I first started trying it more than twenty years ago, could this be a record?

I mostly miss club-passing.

Bob.

Little Paul - - Parent

Bob! Long time no see!

Last I saw of you, you were doing the rounds on the TV quiz circuit, you still quizzing?

Bob Dilworth - - Parent

Hi Paul!

I still do regular pub quizzes but the TV career has been on hold for a while :-). I also play drums in a rock covers band. Still have fond memories of the convention days. How are things in your world?

7b_wizard -

The future of juggling

Juggling will be more popular. - It's not as exhausting as jogging or workout studio and also burns fat in a fun way. It will then also naturally be a topic in sciences and in the media.

There will be a glossary.

There will be more holsters and helps of various kinds.

There will be lots 'a minicopter juggling and a humanoid juggling robot.

There will be world-rankings and distinct proficiency / difficulty-levels, dans or alike.

Rackets will be used.

Many-ball-patterns will be rolled on big inclined planes and there will be more helium prop juggling.

Chinese Circus will (re-)discover toss-juggling.

.. maybe, I could imagine.

Little Paul - - Parent

oh good! I'm looking forward to it being the 1990s again

7b_wizard - - Parent

Yeh, some of it has been done before or exists already, but isn't as common as it will be and not yet as popular as playing frisbee.

pumpkineater23 - - Parent

History repeating. I'm looking forward to the 20s, they'll be the next 90s, just as the 90s were the next 60s. History repeating.

7b_wizard - - Parent

Hm .. siteswap and stickmen weren't there before, though. Some, maybe a lot of old, ancient skills and fashions might have gone lost, but juggling has overall grown in complexity and I wish it furtheron will. I think it deserves it.

pumpkineater23 - - Parent

Internet video has contributed much to the complexity of juggling. The general image of juggling (to non-jugglers) is changing too. In the future juggling might be seen as cool and sexy. Pre-xmas perfume commercials will feature jugglers. 'Kasscade.. le new fragrance.. eau de toilette'.

7b_wizard - - Parent

Haha .. Now you got it!   Xo])

Thom! -

The Smithsonian Insitution's Sidedoor podcast just came out with an episode all about the life and legacy of Paul Cinquevalli! Well worth a listen if for no reason other than to listen to the dulcet tones of Erik Aberg's voice.

Check it out!

https://www.si.edu/sidedoor/ep-7-man-who-defied-gravity

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Very nice, thanks for linking to it and you make a nice appearance in it :)

Orinoco - - Parent

Found a download link for this episode in their RSS feed Sidedoor: ep. 7 | the man who defied gravity (mp3 36.3mb)
.

Thanks for the heads up Thom, just added this to my startling large collection of things to listen to!

Orinoco - - Parent

Ooh! I forgot I did that for mp3 links!

Little Paul - - Parent

Finally managed to get around to listening to this today white I was getting in my pelargoniums and taking cuttings. It was quite a good listen, even if it did give the listener the impression that nothing Cinquevalli did was gimmicked when some of it certainly was.

peterbone - - Parent

Surprised at Erik implying that the tricks were not gimmicked as he has stated here that he believes that at least some of the tricks were gimmicked. Here's the thread where we discussed this previously and an article I linked to that mentions how he might have done the billiard balance trick.

http://www.jugglingedge.com/forum.php?ThreadID=901&SmallID=6644#Small6644

Little Paul - - Parent

I think at least some of it was “editing for the sake of a good story@

erik aberg - - Parent

This interview was over way sooner than I thought. I have not listened to it, so I do not know what parts they used, but we hardly even scratched the surface of Cinquevalli. They asked questions that were rather silly (for an example, what a member of the audience would wear), and kept interrupting me before I could come to any point. Hopefully, there will be a chance of discussing him properly in the future. In terms of Cinquevalli and gimmicked props, the point is that he claimed not to use them, and specifically pointed that out, as a difference to magic. What the actual reality was, can of course be discussed. The distinction between juggling and magic is clear after Cinquevalli, but not before.

peterbone - - Parent

Thanks. I totally understand how they could have quoted you out of context. It seems like Cinquevalli was working to make the distinction between juggling and magic, but then breaking his own rules. I totally understand that his main goal was one of entertainment and making a living though.

mike.armstrong -

The new Karl-Heinz Ziethen book "Juggling, The Past and Future" is finally available from
http://www.lulu.com/shop/karl-heinz-ziethen/juggling-the-past-and-future/hardcover/product-23326325.html

It's pricey but there's 30% off (until 14 September) if you use the voucher code SAVENOW30

Daniel Simu - - Parent

Sounds fantastic, definitely on my wish list!

The voucher code doesn't seem to work for me..

Little Paul - - Parent

Voucher code worked for me :)

Yay! Excited dance time!

Little Paul - - Parent

I just got a really dissapointing email:

It has come to our attention that your order XXXXX cannot be completed because the source files for the project "Juggling, The Past and Future" contain errors preventing it from being printed.

I hope this gets sorted soon, I'm still excited!!!

Ian Marchant - - Parent

I got the same email too. I let Niels know and he said that only this had happend to only 2 orders (yours and mine) but 40 have been printed. On the brightside as I ordered it as soon as it came out I only found a 10 percent discount code but now due to this I can use the 30 percent one!

I am like you super excited.........

Bosco - - Parent

I've just had this email back too

"It has come to our attention that your order ******** cannot be completed because the source files for the project "Juggling, The Past and Future" contain errors preventing it from being printed. We've unfortunately had no choice but to remove this item from your order, and have refunded you accordingly.
We'll also be contacting the author to make them aware of the problem, but we do apologize for any inconvenience that this may create."

I'll have another go and see what happens.

Little Paul - - Parent

It's taken until this morning for the refund to hit my account, so I'll try again today - you might not want to try again too quickly as you may end up temporarily shorter on funds than you expect!

Ian Marchant - - Parent

Hei Bosco,

I tried again and got the exact same thing happen again so i'd hold off for a while. There seems to be a problem with the uk printers from what Niels was saying when I contacted him.

Dee - - Parent

I also got the same message, so its definitely being consistent with those based in the UK.

Now won't get to apply that lovely 30% discount.

Ian Marchant - - Parent

Yes it is, I got a message from Niels today and he has made a UK version, here's the link:

http://www.lulu.com/shop/karl-heinz-ziethen/juggling-the-past-and-future-uk-edition/hardcover/product-23333193.html

He said that its been made to the spec for the UK printers so orders should be ok now.

Regarding the discount, I asked Lulu direct about that and they said:

"Wonderful question!

It depends entirely on the promotions being advertised on the homepage of our website, as they periodically change. When you have a moment, visit our homepage at http://www.lulu.com/home to review the promotions currently available.

At the moment, "SAVENOW30" is still ongoing, but it is scheduled to end at midnight tonight (EST).

If you'd like to use the voucher, be sure to have an order in production before the promotion ends - otherwise you may have to wait until another offer of equal value is advertised".


As much as I want to order the book right away I'm gonna wait until there a good discount code as I've tasted the discount nectar and it was good!

Daniel Simu - - Parent

It does work if I open the UK version of Lulu, on the Dutch one it does not!

Little Paul - - Parent

Awesome! I got the notification a couple of days ago but was waiting for a voucher to turn up! :)

Bosco - - Parent

Remarkable. Having had "time out" I return to the Edge with 12670 unread posts, and K-HZ's book appears with a voucher. I'm a very happy person! Thank you everyone for posting.

pumpkineater23 - - Parent

Has anyone read it? What kind of things does he see the future of juggling being?

pumpkineater23 - - Parent

The future of juggling isn't books by the sounds of it..

mike.armstrong - - Parent

For those of us in the UK whose orders were cancelled - there's currently 20% off if you use coupon code LULU20.

There's also a "buy 3 books, get the 4th free" offer on (which would be 25% off) - does anyone want to join me for a joint order of 4 copies? I can bring them to Durham or Leeds conventions

Cheers
-Mike

JonPeat - - Parent

Hi Mike,
I'm in.
I sent you a message.
Cheers, Jon

Thom! -

Balancing and juggling (and juggling and balancing)

Hey guys!

I wrote up a little tutorial on learning to juggle with a balance (or... is it learning to balance with a juggle?..!)

Thought some of you might get a kick out of it! Curious to hear if my experiences are parallel with any of your own.

http://thomwall.com/balancing-and-juggling/

Cheers!

--Thom

Cedric Lackpot - - Parent

That was an excellent read, thank you. Please show it to /r/juggling as well if you haven't already.

I found myself both agreeing and disagreeing with so much of it. But that's a reflection of my understanding of the trick, which has changed considerably over time. I used to think that it should be regarded as a single trick rather than a combination of two, but I eventually realised that it's better if you let the balance come first. I'm still not sure it isn't actually a single trick, but nowadays I very much agree with the importance of focusing on the balance.

But since I learned the trick before I learned to focus completely on the balance it seems evident that one can divide one's attention somewhat, and still succeed. It's hard to remember but I think back then I tried not to look at any one thing at all, just see the whole picture.

Thom! - - Parent

Thanks, Cedric! Just posted it over on Reddit. (Feel free to give an upvote! ha!)

I'm still not sure it's a single trick, either, haha. I think that three with a balance is certainly "canon" enough that can stand on its own as a trick, but find that learning different tricks while maintaining the balance makes that perspective lacking... (would you agree?)

Your comment about dividing attention definitely corresponds with my experience with headbounce... if you focus on any one thing too much, it all falls apart. You've got to see the whole thing all at once!

Little Paul - - Parent

Just got around to reading it, and I think that you've covered everything I either picked up from other people or intuitively tried in the "conscious incompetence" phase.

I like the way you've written it up and illustrated it though - and I think you actually managed to describe why I've never found the forehead balance as comfortable as everyone seems to have told me it is - it's because I have to flip my perception.

You might even have inspired me to have another crack at getting it solid.

Thom! - - Parent

Awesome! I'm really excited that there wasn't much new info in there for you, actually... Doing my best to be comprehensive with these posts, and if I've covered everything that's occurred to you, I must be doing something right!

The Void - - Parent

Good stuff. When learning the Bungay trick, I remembered Haggis McLeod's exhortation from his Club Juggling instructional video: DON'T DROP THE BALANCE. (Which pretty much summarises your article in a sentence.) It's really hard to keep doing that when you're first trying to add some throws under the balance, but it pays dividends in the end.

I never did work hard enough on just a club balance with a cascade. Maybe I should try again....

Thom! - - Parent

Way cool! Is Haggis' video online anywhere? I'd love to see it!

The Void - - Parent

I don't think so. Theoretically, it's still for sale, I believe.

Little Paul - - Parent

I think I made a VHS rip of it and still have it on my PC somewhere, but I didn't put it online because oddballs were selling it on DVD at the time.

It makes for wonderful "omg the hair! The clothes! The sheer bloody 1990s of it all"

Scott Seltzer - - Parent

Good stuff, Thom. A few thoughts:

I think I remember hearing that Gatto recommended the forehead balance since it gives the audience a better view of your face. That insight is presumably from Nick, actually. So, forehead might be better for performer-types.

The Reading Test is my favorite drill before you put it all together. Work on it a lot after your balance is solid and before you work on adding the juggling. Try to get your head back as far as you can, even looking up somewhat behind straight up so you rely on minimal peripheral vision of the clubs.

Placing into a Balance - the trick here is to catch the club you're going to put into a balance up high and as close to the balance point as possible so there's not a lot of movement (and time) to get it into the balance. Watch people doing constant balances on one side and you'll see very high catches and minimal movement to actually put the clubs into the balance/roll).

One thing you didn't mention is clubs vs balls. Learning with 3 clubs is much easier than with 3 balls since you will see the clubs easier with your peripheral vision than balls which are generally thrown lower (throwing them high enough for suitable juggling with a balance is an unnatural slow rhythm). 4 balls is similarish height to 3 clubs so a reasonable start for those who prefer sphericals. I think it was "The Complete Juggler" that suggested that even numbers might actually be easier for juggling with a balance.

peterbone - - Parent

I'm guessing that even numbers would only be easier for the nose or chin balance since the club would obscure the crossing point of the cascade.

Funny that you say up high when referring to what I would call the bottom of the handle. Perhaps your mental model of a club is the other way round to mine. The disadvantage of catching near the knob for placing into a balance is that it's harder to get it to the right angle, but you're right that it can be quicker and easier to position it accurately.

Scott Seltzer - - Parent

By "up high" I meant with your arm raised up high, right near your forehead. Another thing about this is that the throw should be one and a quarter spin so instead of catching the club perpendicular to your body line like normal, you catching it more vertically, oriented and ready for quick placement on your face.

peterbone - - Parent

OK, I see. Misunderstood you completely then.

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