Viewing all threads tagged #metatalk.
Just copied live some changes to the records section. The goal is to fix a number of usability issues pointed out by Varkor. The focus has shifted from 'what records have been posted recently' to 'what is the top record'. There is more consistency on what links lead where, I've taken out some stuff that was never used & fixed a load more minor errors. Let me know what you think.
Thank you Varkor for the suggestions. Alternative entry method still to come...
Thank you for creating the Records part of this site. Records is great data.
I preferred the way it was. I liked being able to see recently posted records, and I can only see those on the 'Latest Activity' on the index page now. Recent records are relevant to Logs and Small Talk, and add to the Juggling Edge experience.
Hall-of-fame should be listed by order of record popularity : 7b Cascade (488 records), 5b Cascade (455 records), 6b fountain (333 records), 5c Cascade (303 records), etc.
"I liked being able to see recently posted records" - Is it possible to have top records and most recent records side by side, nicely formatted, on the records screen, Mr God Emperor?
Mats1: It is possible but you know more people use phones than desktops now right?
You can still access most recent records. If that's the main thing you are missing I've added a link to latest records at the top of each page
In the last 4 months only 4 people have accessed the download links, so I'm afraid they will always be at the bottom.
Noted on the videos I can't tell who clicks links to external sites. This is not something I've thought about. I will have a think.
'Your current rank' means your best record ranks 31st out of everyone who has logged a record for that trick.
I don't want to stick my oar in too much as I don't use the records section - but would "31st out of 76" make it clearer?
Looks very reduced now ..
Latest, recently posted records (on any trick or s'swap):
are they still accessible, as no link seems to point there anymore now that the top records link points to all records? I liked to follow all new records to see what there happened outstanding ones and ones that I work on myself. The recent records page just showed more and all for download in case there were many records logged on a day since my last visit that wouldn't show up in the summary. Now one will actually miss these recent ones older than summary, but recent since last visit.
Specific records for a trick / s'swap:
the lists for these now show only the top 20. You can't compare yourself to who's on similar level as yourself anymore. 5b cascade for example starts showing up at James Hennigan's 1117 catches (http://www.jugglingedge.com/records.php?PropNumber=5&PropType=b&Trick=cas). Everyone below that working on 5b cascade will not even show up.
(Did find a way to browse specific tricks' recent history, though: download csv and simply open it with a plain text editor. It shows that tricks' logging chronology.)
Also you don't see anymore how many people are working on that specific trick.
One doesn't anymore see what people except the few cracks are working on. Especially the popular frequently logged tricks.
[varkor in meta:] Honestly, I think other than a global "recent records" section, wanting to see the records that have recently been logged is very uncommon—I'd much rather see all-time records (i.e. in the table).
I think it was adding to transparency of what people are actually working on thus adding to knowing about what tricks single users, but also the community is presently focussing on. (Like, I thought to have spotted an increased interest in bodythrows, after last year it was boxes; sth "with balance" or "with head bounce" being unchangedly all time popular). But, well, if it's never been used .. I might have been the only one interested in what others log, whereas i thought that was part of the sense of logging records here. And all-time records were there before, maybe just not linked as expected, no? Hm ..
Now, that clicking an user (or oneself, if even showing up among top 20) in a tricks record list points to all that user's records, lower ranked user's records logging history, one's latest records, for that trick is also like .. gone. Only accessible over the "entries" for top 20 users. Clicking on "my records" gets me to all my records .. no my logging history and progress chart anymore!? [somewhat messy .. I don't look through it all .. A'll just click ("PREVIEW", then) "POST" ;o) .. ]
Is there a reason, a consideration on appearance impacting on community and communication behind this? I think records and their logging's data are by nature complex and sortable in many ways (by trick, by date, by user, by ranking) and there might be no easy way to browse them (present and link them respectively) in respect to usability. Or is there else a mass of data and webspace issue?
Latest records except for summary on front page .. gone.
Anything below top 20 of a trick .. gone.
Individual progress chart and latest records logs except for top 20 .. gone.
Ah! .. found a way to browse my progress: http://www.jugglingedge.com/records.php?UserID=885&PropNumber=5&PropType=b&Trick=cas - simply edit my UserID into the url of another user's chart. Or generally us editing the url. So it's not all gone :o)
I was prompted by Varkor's post which made sense to me. I enabled logging of what links got clicked for a few months to see if I could spot any trends.
The main consideration for the change is that over 60% of people took one look at the records page then did not visit any other pages. Which is a pretty clear signal that it was not working! So I just want to try something different for a while.
Most people enter the site into Small talk & browse through 2 or 3 pages (Hello! Come & join in!), next in popularity is the events section where people will view 5 or so events which is pretty fantastic. Records is the 3rd most popular entry section.
Those that were clicking through to other records pages were clicking through to a specific trick, which used to contain a leaderboard of the top 50, a list of people also working on the trick which in practice just duplicated the leaderboard. Very few people were clicking through to a user's records that wasn't their own.
I've got individual progress charts showing in the dev site, not sure why they aren't in the live site. I'll have a look at that in a second...
Webspace isn't an issue but the records section is by far the most complex part of the site & Dreamhost's sql servers aren't the best available in terms of query speed, so too many complex queries can have an impact on the rest of the site which I want to avoid.
Ah! Everything's back now ("latest records", progress & chart). Great! Thanks for changing that!
How can I view my comments on old records? I can see a few of them in the 'Latest Records' section, but I can't find ones that are months old. Previously, when I clicked on my 6 ball fountain record, I would get a graph followed by a list of all the records I logged for that trick, including the comments I left on them. Now I only get a graph: http://www.jugglingedge.com/records.php?UserID=990&PropNumber=6&PropType=b&Trick=ftn
Some of us mainly use the records section to track our personal progress, but now it seems like it's only made for the best jugglers to compete against each other. When I click on the '6 ball fountain' link on MY personal records page, it seems much more sensible that I should get a list of all my records for that trick, and not be sent to the leaderboard.
Also there are 2 minor issues I've spotted:
I'm currently 14th on the 6 ball leaderboard, but my rank is apparently 21. Similarly, I'm 20th on the 5 ball leaderboard, but my rank is 33.
Some identical tricks are listed separately e.g. (8x,6)* and (8x,6)(6,8x), 0 and 0.
The leaderboards have always been exclusive. The previous leaderboards showed a maximum of 50 people. It's now set to 20 which I'd argue is still too high, I think most people don't care past the top 5. The new format is less exclusive because no matter where you rank your position is displayed.
Playing with it all a bit more though, I think you are right about links from your records page. Personally there are only two records that I am personally interested in and I can easily remember what they are so I don't need to see my own records. However, I can see that for people tracking lots of records this would not be the case. Sorry Varkor, I get that having the same links pointing to two different pages depending on context is generally a no-no on the web but point 2 revoked (But 1, 3, 4, 5, 6 stand!), links from a user's records page now back to linking to their records only.
I've also added back the records stream in a couple of places that hopefully should placate those that miss it.
For the 2 minor issues, counting is now corrected & identical tricks merged.
I appreciate that this has been quite a big change which appears to be unpopular. Please bear in mind that most people don't complain, they just go elsewhere, so I do need to make decisions based on how I see people using the site.
Which is not to say I don't want any complaints, please keep the feedback coming. Dealing with feedback is a lot easier than trawling through access logs trying to filter out human traffic from bot traffic.
Thanks very much for your response. There still seems to be an issue with the ranks. I'm 20 on the 5 ball leaderboard but my rank is 21.
Could there be links at the top to the different prop types? - to save scrolling past all the boring props to get to the more interesting records.
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