Forum

Search posts

Viewing all threads tagged #competition.

View older threads

7b_wizard -

practise versus ``talent´´

(no matter which level you're on - just started or world champion ..)
How much do you think that all your skills are (to which part) a result of practise or hard ``work´´, perseverance, or else
(to which part) did they ``come to you´´ by a natural preference for juggling (or object manipulation or artistry oror) or by a natural predisposition or a love for juggling making learning easier (than e.g. for the average juggler, or e.g. than learning another skill or art of motion or sportive activity)?

  1. no talent or predisposition or preference - it's 100% hard work or perseverant regular practise or strong will only got me there.
  2. some talent or predisposition or preference - but mostly practise or work or perseverance or strong will.
  3. a good portion of talent or predisposition or preference - but somewhat more practise or work or perseverance or strong will.
  4. about equal.
  5. somewhat more talent or predisposition or preference - but it couldn't have grown & developed without a notable and regular amount of practise or work or perseverance or strong will.
  6. notably more talent or predisposition or preference - but it won't yield without a bit of practise or coping with or some will to improve.
  7. I learn extremely fast and don't see upper limits below highest levels. I think, I'm a ``natural´´.
  8. other \ depends \ easy for s'swaps and few prop tricks, but hard for numbers \ easy for basic patterns, but hard for tricks


A few aspects helping to answer:
Even Gatto said sth like, there's no such thing talent on his level or for him - it was all hard hard work.
Think of what you can't do even though you think you should.
Was your decision or how you got to juggling totally intrinsic (=absolutely "yours" and the only thing to do, ``necessary´´ in a way) or could it just aswell have been something else, another hobby or activity.
Do you see yourself improving and learning much faster than others (that's the point, not learning easy stuff fast only).
Do others admire the speed you improve or learn (while you yourself might not have noticed).

And a question that I'm interested in:
Do you think or have you experienced a hidden talent waking up after already having juggled for a good while? Do you think that's possible to ``wake up the natural inside you´´?

This is a competition thread which ran from 30th Sep 2017 to 10th Oct 2017. View results.

7b_wizard - - Parent

I myself am somewhere between 2 and 3, but sill blundering a real lot when not yet warmed up or when not concentrating, also failing over long phases, makes me say "2", even though I hope for it to become easier, maybe the natural skill inside waking up, some day when I've reached my goals and then not having to so much do at the limit anymore. I don't think I'd have gotten where I am without the inner decision to dedicate to the 7b cascade, which is maybe rather a preference than ``natural talent´´, who knows.

7b_wizard - - Parent

If i get 13 catches of 9b today or 7b > 100 c, I'll change to "5" ;o])

Daniel Simu - - Parent

You're asking multiple questions at once, which makes it hard to answer correctly...

I think I have some but little natural talent in learning object manipulation skills. However I am extremely predisposed to love juggling which makes it incredibly easy to spend countless hours on practice. So effectively my natural affection for juggling makes me a good juggler?

7b_wizard - - Parent

Yes, [>>"multiple wording"<<], wanted to include a wide range of viewpoints for "talent\\not talent".

Okay, that makes it a bit difficult ("little natural talent, but love for juggling making practise easy"),
but, as the question is scaled along "talent vs. practise", I'd say, your description says, that your love for juggling sort of enables or helps you to make up for little natural talent. But you don't sound, like new skills ``come to you´´ or that your natural afffection for juggling makes learning (notably) easier than for the average juggler or than another activity - at least not in a way that would spare you to still having to practise a whole lot. That would be a clear "2", I'd say.

So, @ all, if in doubt, feel free to read the options as roughly ..

1. 0-5% talent - 95-100% practise (hard work only)
2. 5-25% talent - 75-95% practise
3. 25-45% talent - 55-75% practise
4. 45-55% talent - 45-55% practise (equal)
5. 55-75% talent - 25-45% practise
6. 75-95% talent - 5-25% practise
7. 95-100% talent - 0-5% practise (pure talent, just do it and it will naturally succeed in ridiculously short time)

Orinoco - - Parent

I put myself down as a number 2. I think I'm very similar to Daniel, I got good at juggling because when I first started I enjoyed it so much I did nothing but practice. Perhaps because of my enjoyment I didn't realise it was 'hard work'.

peterbone - - Parent

Agreed. The choices are made a bit complex by the 'love of juggling' part, which I think makes the vote lose focus on the nature vs nurture argument. I think that any natural aptitude is very small, but I voted 2 for the same reason as you.

Interesting Gatto's comment that he thinks it was all hard work. Where does that quote come from? On his own forum years ago he said that he believes he has some kind of natural advantage and sees things "in slow motion". Although I don't believe that at all I do think that believing it helped him a lot.

Scott Seltzer - - Parent

I always thought that seeing things in slow motion is acquired. When you first start attempting 5 balls it feels frantic and crazy fast and impossible. After a while (perhaps a few years or more), it can seem slow and simple. Gravity obviously hasn't changed but your perception has.

Sometime after I was pretty solid with 5 balls, I remember when it really clicked even more and became truly effortless. I fondly remember that as my juggling nirvana.

7b_wizard - - Parent

That 'love of juggling' wording is due to me trying to exclude, that ``talent´´ (which anyway is hard to seize as notion) need be determined by some genetic predisposition, let alone by a distinct ``juggling gene´´. And I tried to allow, that a wunderkind could feel as a natural without a need to have genetic evidence, without the need to have been ``born as juggler´´, just with love of juggling, then. Also, I wanted to avoid any discussion about whether ``(genetic) talent´´ even exists or not.

That Gatto statement is nothing like a citation with a source; I had it in mind, read it somewhere - it might be a mere rumour or misinterpretation (alas, I have no idea, where I got that from).

Mike Moore - - Parent

I'd put me somewhere between 5-6. When I can dredge up enough time to practice daily, I feel my progress goes by leaps and bounds, and it seems like I could be /very/ good if I were to try to make a career of juggling (or prioritize it higher).

There are certainly people who pick things up faster than me, but that population seems to be somewhere between 10-25 % of jugglers I know. There's probably some selection bias in there.

pumpkineater23 - - Parent

I'm a 2. I find it very difficult to understand juggling patterns and I've always learned everything slower than most. My love of juggling has helped me keep up the practicing.

Marvin - - Parent

This poll has now ended. The results are:

  1.   no talent or predisposition or preference - it's 100% hard work or perseverant regular practise or strong will only got me there. (0 votes)
  2.   some talent or predisposition or preference - but mostly practise or work or perseverance or strong will. (6 votes)
  3.   a good portion of talent or predisposition or preference - but somewhat more practise or work or perseverance or strong will. (1 vote)
  4.   about equal. (0 votes)
  5.   somewhat more talent or predisposition or preference - but it couldn't have grown & developed without a notable and regular amount of practise or work or perseverance or strong will. (0 votes)
  6.   notably more talent or predisposition or preference - but it won't yield without a bit of practise or coping with or some will to improve. (1 vote)
  7.   I learn extremely fast and don't see upper limits below highest levels. I think, I'm a ``natural´´. (0 votes)
  8.   other \ depends \ easy for s'swaps and few prop tricks, but hard for numbers \ easy for basic patterns, but hard for tricks (1 vote)

7b_wizard -

How much do you  a c c e p t   h e l p,  hints or helpful feedback for improving? (no matter wherefrom, video tutorial, or person to person, shown or told or written, ororor)

  1. I am stubborn and want to make my own way all on my own even biting myself through plateaus. (thus doing purely my own way, maybe leading to my genuine 100% own style)
  2. I usually want to find my own way through and reject any help, but I thankfully take help when really badly stuck for a long time.
    .. or ..
    Practical feedback rather irritates or puzzles me, brings me out, so I'd generally prefer doing without.
    [ both options = can take, or want little help ]
  3. I am happy for help when I asked for or when the hint is good and applies.
  4. I am happy for any help I can get - I'll try everything out and filter what applies for me.
  5. Without constant help, always a teacher there to guide me, or a good resource (book, eBook, video tutorial series, ..) I would not a whit get anyhwere ahead.
  6. [ other .. no one helps .. \ .. help is always bad .. \ .. I'm immune against improving, no matter how good the help is .. \ .. There's nothing to improve - my 3b cascade is perfectly fluent. :o} ]

This is a competition thread which ran from 13th May 2017 to 22nd May 2017. View results.

Maria - - Parent

I voted 4, I'll try most things suggested by better jugglers, but I don't keep working on it if it's too boring (for example, I have not learned 4c fountain on singles, even though I have been told it could help improve my 4c fountain on doubles). I don't really come up with many ideas by myself, either. I mean, I can come up with a new combination of throws, but I don't really invent anything completely new.

As a club passer who usually passes with someone better than me, option 5 would not have been wrong either.

Maria - - Parent

...and I have not learned 5 ball cascade, even though I'm trying to learn 5 clubs.

Mike Moore - - Parent

I'm somewhere in the 3.5 camp. If I can be particular about the phrasing "when the hint is good and applies" to be "[...] as interpreted by some all-knowing being," then I'm comfortable with it. Sometimes I don't realize the hint is good until a while after it was given.

7b_wizard - - Parent

Hmhm, I see; maybe we can meet on "if a hint gets you thinking or rumors around in your mind not knowing what rhyme to make of it", then it can still either puzzle and irritate you beyond threshold, or else, you can be ``happy´´ on there being a new way waiting to be discovered some given time later. Or even else, it's stored somewhere in the unconscious until it pops up again at a given moment or remains there forever until the ``hard disk´´ (=memory) is cleaned and overwritten. ( Which still leaves the decision "happy or not about such an unclear hint" to you :o] ) .. but, yeah, if an all-knowing being knows before, read as: "If a hint will apply, later (and I will be happy about it, later)."

.. or just read "3." and "4." as:

3. Happy for help "under condition". (not "any and all the help you can get" unrestrictedly)
4. "Give it all over to me, I'll sort it out." = Any and all the help there might be is welcome. (without any restriction)

Basically the scale goes from 1. "no input whatsoever" over 2. "little help accepted", 3. ``Some´´ or ``a good deal´´ or "under condition" help accepted, 4. All, every, any help (more than) welcome, upto 5. "only with help, can't do without".

7b_wizard - - Parent

btw i'm not sure what to vote myself .. been through like all of the options 1. to 4. before, i think, and now it seems to "depend" on which pattern, which ajuggling (few ball stuff, e.g. Kraken, or else numbers techniques). Even 6., "I don't get info on what exactly is going in the brain and focus and where attention lays in distinct milliseconds." is partly true.

Guess I'll land on 3. or 4. too, as there's yet so much to discover (clubs, 5b s'swaps, selfthrows and fountains, more body range e.g. bbb, for me), .. why not spare time and effort by getting all and any help I can get to get where I want sooner.

Marvin - - Parent

This poll has now ended. The results are:

  1.   I am stubborn and want to make my own way all on my own even biting myself through plateaus. (thus doing purely my own way, maybe leading to my genuine 100% own style) (0 votes)
  2.   I usually want to find my own way through and reject any help, but I thankfully take help when really badly stuck for a long time.
    .. or ..
    Practical feedback rather irritates or puzzles me, brings me out, so I'd generally prefer doing without.
    [ both options = can take, or want little help ] (1 vote)
  3.   I am happy for help when I asked for or when the hint is good and applies. (4 votes)
  4.   I am happy for any help I can get - I'll try everything out and filter what applies for me. (4 votes)
  5.   Without constant help, always a teacher there to guide me, or a good resource (book, eBook, video tutorial series, ..) I would not a whit get anyhwere ahead. (0 votes)
  6.   [ other .. no one helps .. \ .. help is always bad .. \ .. I'm immune against improving, no matter how good the help is .. \ .. There's nothing to improve - my 3b cascade is perfectly fluent. :o} ] (0 votes)

7b_wizard -

How much of you, your time, being sportive, self-chosen active, (no matter if overall a lot or just a little), goes into juggling?

  1. 85-100%. I merely voluntarily move, unless I'm juggling.
  2. 60-85%. Juggling's not only, but overall n° 1 activity. (little other sports)
  3. 50-60%. Juggling has some priority or somewhat more time spent on among all other activities taken together.
  4. 40-50%. Juggling has rather less priority or less time spent on among all other activities taken together.
  5. 15-40%. Juggling is just one among any other activity(ies), or not so important, or even less important, or I clearly spend notably less time on juggling.
  6. 0-15%. Among any amount of sportive activities, juggling takes in the smallest part.
  7. [other]

Not counting ``necessary´´ activities like work, travelling, footwalks or so, only leisure.
I'll leave it upto you, if biking to the baker or having to do like school sports, or fitness prescribed by your doctor, pumpin' up stairs instead takin' the elevator or so is ``necessary´´, unavoidable (would then not count) or ``self-chosen´´ or ``leisure´´ (then would count as ``self-chosen sportive activity´´).
Hope, it's somewhat logically consistent - it's not about "how much" you juggle, and also not about "how sportive" or "how active" you are, but  w h i c h   p a r t  juggling takes  a m o n g  any of your other sportive activities taken together.   Thx 4 voting! :o)

This is a competition thread which ran from 3rd May 2017 to 14th May 2017. View results.

Maria - - Parent

I'd guess about 80%. A normal week has 7-8 hours juggling, and 1-2 hours other "sport activities" (going to a gym, a BodyBalance class, a long walk or something like that). I didn't count walking to and from work, though I could choose to go by bus or car instead but it's just 15-20 minutes walk.

During summer a normal week has less juggling (no scheduled practice), but then there are juggling conventions, where I don't do any sports but juggling.

I used to go for walks to relax or just get some physical activity, but most of those volontary walks have been replaced by juggling during the last years.

Orinoco - - Parent

But it's an ART!

/me runs

7b_wizard - - Parent

Haha, okay, "How much of your arty activities or any activity at all goes into juggling?".

Mike Moore - - Parent

Orin, if you don't answer this question, I'll be very disappointed!

Orinoco - - Parent

Can't answer. Still running.

Mike Moore - - Parent

+1

(Still chuckling)

Orinoco - - Parent

Hard one to judge. My two other main hobbies, (dancing & roller hockey) are much higher in intensity so they feel like they make up a much higher percentage of my active time than they probably do.

I also want to count hand balancing as juggling but that shouldn't be the case.

Austin - - Parent

Funny you should say that, as I have been playing tennis for 10 years but I still find juggling a far, far more intensive activity.

Orinoco - - Parent

Interesting.

With juggling the better I get the less effort is required. With the other two the better I get the more energy I can put in without catastrophic failure.

With dancing being in control allows me to be more exuberant & exciting which is more fun for me & more fun for most of my partners. With hockey being in control allows me to be faster which is an obvious performance advantage. The same could be true of my juggling, but when I juggle I just want to be in control, aside from playing combat I feel there is no incentive to apply unnecessary energy to my juggling.

7b_wizard - - Parent

The same could be true of my juggling, but when I juggle I just want to be in control, aside from playing combat I feel there is no incentive to apply unnecessary energy to my juggling. Humh, is that,, you're ``done with improving´´ and you're happy with what you have under control. Or else, is that exactly your way to best improve fromout controlled ajuggling, even without ``pushing´´ any?

Austin - - Parent

That makes sense, but for me the better I get the longer runs I do and the harder and more energy intensive tricks I do. I've never been one for getting easier tricks totally solid really. I don't think I'll ever reach a point where I feel good enough, because I'll never be the best so it's just a matter of being as good as I can be.

7b_wizard - - Parent

Yeah, please feel free to vote by "time invested" OR by "intensity" (or effort or zeal or dediction) put into the juggling part in compare to all other activity.

The poll should find out, what I think is interesting, if juggling is among if any or among all other your most prominent ado or activity or physical exercise or moving artistically or getting one's bottom up from the couch at all. Its priority, its importance, its significance among ``being in motion in one's free time´´.

7b_wizard - - Parent

I like to count any kind of balance - unless most focus goes into strength and balancing is the least challenging, a negligible part of the act - .. count it as very much a juggling exercise. After all, a well juggled higher pattern is always also well balanced in your airspace and relative to one's body axes.

7b_wizard - - Parent

I myself used to wander, and upto the day bike like daily (thinking of quitting that, even I think it's very healthy), sometimes for leisure swim a bit, give a nice frisbee or so, and for a while jog 5 km or run 800 m almost daily (many years ago). Now, apart from just a few minutes doing some gym, stretching, bending, or from time to time maybe doing pushups or pull ups or situps for general form and flexibility, I try to not waiste any energy that I can save for juggling. = clearly "1".

Scott Seltzer - - Parent

Aside from 2 annual juggling conventions and 1 music festival that I go to for the juggling booth, I spend approximately 0 hours/week juggling. Oh, I may get 10 juggling shows/year these days, but that's insignificant (though I do break a good sweat). I spend about 10 hours/week doing sports (tennis, running, biking). I spend around 10 hours/week with online juggling adventures.

Little Paul - - Parent

What he said (but with less time playing sport during the week and a lot more walking - minimum of 10Km a day)

I should pull my finger out and start running again, or get back down the gym. My middle age is spreading

Mike Moore - - Parent

A big reason that I do other exercise in my life is that I find it so substantially improves my juggling. When I'm practicing hard, it's about a 50-50 split between juggling and other sporty activities. When I'm being lazy, juggling makes up ~70 % of my sporty activities (despite other activities and juggling both decreasing in time).

Marvin - - Parent

This poll has now ended. The results are:

  1.   85-100%. I merely voluntarily move, unless I'm juggling. (4 votes)
  2.   60-85%. Juggling's not only, but overall n° 1 activity. (little other sports) (6 votes)
  3.   50-60%. Juggling has some priority or somewhat more time spent on among all other activities taken together. (5 votes)
  4.   40-50%. Juggling has rather less priority or less time spent on among all other activities taken together. (0 votes)
  5.   15-40%. Juggling is just one among any other activity(ies), or not so important, or even less important, or I clearly spend notably less time on juggling. (1 vote)
  6.   0-15%. Among any amount of sportive activities, juggling takes in the smallest part. (0 votes)
  7.   [other] (0 votes)

7b_wizard - - Parent

I'm not surprised .. it does say "juggling" on top and in the url after all ;o]

7b_wizard -

Do you like \ not like to  t e a c h  (not just give a hint, but take the time and get involved, and real life person to person) ?

  1. Nah, it's boring, tedious, only costs my precious time, brings me nothing.
  2. Rather not, but can happen.
  3. Sometimes maybe. So so.
  4. Rather yes.
  5. Absolutely - love it .. seeing the progress, the success, sharing those "Aha"-Moments, growing a passing partner, doing "together".
  6. [ other \ depends \ do it, but don't like it \ love it, but don't have time \ never tried \ none, all of the above \ .. ]

Thanks for voting!

[ #teaching ]

This is a competition thread which ran from 19th Apr 2017 to 7th May 2017. View results.

Mike Moore - - Parent

Voted depends: I usually try to spend about 20 minutes at club practice focusing and getting some really good practice in. During that time, I don't want to teach, talk, listen, etc.

Other than that, I'm normally happy to teach.

Maria - - Parent

The last one. I like it, but I don't want to spend my precious juggling time doing something else than juggling (at least not too often). And regular juggling club meetings is usually the only place where someone is interesting in letting me teach them some juggling, so... I don't really teach much.

I should try to give some workshops on juggling conventions, though. I can't juggle all the time there anyway, and I tried it as a co-teacher in a passing workshop at the last BJC and really liked that. Now I just need to find something that I think I can actually teach well enough for a workshop.

Ah, yeah, I like to teach non-juggling things, too... As long as the person/people learning wants to learn, not if I'm trying to teach a whole class where some people would rather not be there at all. Though I usually don't have time or opportunities for that, either.

Marvin - - Parent

This poll has now ended. The results are:

  1.   Nah, it's boring, tedious, only costs my precious time, brings me nothing. (1 vote)
  2.   Rather not, but can happen. (0 votes)
  3.   Sometimes maybe. So so. (1 vote)
  4.   Rather yes. (2 votes)
  5.   Absolutely - love it .. seeing the progress, the success, sharing those "Aha"-Moments, growing a passing partner, doing "together". (9 votes)
  6.   [ other \ depends \ do it, but don't like it \ love it, but don't have time \ never tried \ none, all of the above \ .. ] (4 votes)

7b_wizard -

Do you find it easy or hard to stand on one leg for a while while juggling an easy pattern?

  1. Pretty easy.
  2. Rather easy.
  3. Not so easy.
  4. Difficult.
  5. [ other .. depends .. neither, nor .. ]

This is a competition thread which ran from 1st Apr 2017 to 8th Apr 2017. View results.

Marvin - - Parent

This poll has now ended. The results are:

  1.   Pretty easy. (6 votes)
  2.   Rather easy. (1 vote)
  3.   Not so easy. (0 votes)
  4.   Difficult. (0 votes)
  5.   [ other .. depends .. neither, nor .. ] (0 votes)

7b_wizard - - Parent

Ah, okay. Thx for voting & plotting :o]

7b_wizard -

How do you launch your numbers basic patterns?

  1. In a clear crescendo way, as a ``ladder´´, starting with lower throws getting upon height towards the later throws.
  2. A mix of 1. and 3., pretty much the same height as good as I can get it, but the very first one or two throws a bit lower. And-Or doing the two or three latest throws just a little bit higher to have the launch better well-spaced.
  3. All on the exact height required (from first throw on), thus also in the right tact.
  4. Different ways, or all of the above, or depending on which pattern, which number, or with a special initial throw or kick, or with a siteswap, or from juggling a lower number (only part of the props) with full hands.

[ #numbers #launch #technique #poll ]

This is a competition thread which ran from 26th Sep 2016 to 16th Oct 2016. View results.

James Hennigan - - Parent

Don't lots of jugglers do the opposite of 1? They throw the first ball higher and all the other throws are at regular height.

Example: https://youtu.be/Jpah1ywgZUk?start=298

7b_wizard - - Parent

Never seen this. Very interesting; it seems to earn a moment to prepare and get back in position for the steady launch with one ball less.

DavidCain - - Parent

Yes, Gatto made that method fairly popular.
David

7b_wizard - - Parent

He should then vote "4.".

No, serious: I see two slight disadvantages in that method (regardless of how much these might be outweighed by the advantages), at least when still learning:   a)   the very high first ball comes back very fast, thus is a bit harder to catch or at least ask for a different first catch, and   b)   it's out of tact and out of pattern and tact, so timing your launch to it, matching both, seems a skill on its own, maybe comparable to kicking into launch.

peterbone - - Parent

The advantage is that it makes the first throws easier when there's a lot of weight in the hands. Perhaps Anthony developed that method because he started numbers so young. I tend to do it a bit with clubs.

When flashing high numbers I prefer 1 or 2. The advantage being that they separate out in the air making the catches further apart. When running numbers I prefer 3.

7b_wizard - - Parent

I like the first two pairs of throws notably lower and wider, to have the middle free to fire the rest up keeping a slight crescendo. (Clearly "1." then, and for 9b and 7b) My 8b wimpy, I do it in a `robotic´ way all to same exact height - there's just much more time to swing up thrust in synch.

James Hennigan - - Parent

This reminded me that Anthony could juggle 5 clubs before he could even hold 5 clubs!

https://youtu.be/4TAle4wftR4?start=231

bad1dobby - - Parent

I put that down to hype - no-one does bullshit like circus does bullshit...

Daniel Simu - - Parent

To me it makes a lot of sense. The first ball is hard because the hands are heavy. You can make the first high throw easy by using the legs, and the legs add so much push that you can even make enough time to slow down the next one or two balls. With more time you can also put more force in these.. Until you quickly need to get your hands empty to make the first catches, and then stabilize into pattern hight as you only need to deal with 1 ball weight..

7b_wizard - - Parent

Ah, yeah .. ``hop´´ the first one up - forgot about that one.

And, true, yeah, .. once they're all up, be it only halfway aligned, spaced and timed, you can still correct into pattern dealing with one prop each rethrow, which makes up a bit for a flawly launch - I need that a lot ;o) .

Marvin - - Parent

This poll has now ended. The results are:

  1.   In a clear crescendo way, as a ``ladder´´, starting with lower throws getting upon height towards the later throws. (1 vote)
  2.   A mix of 1. and 3., pretty much the same height as good as I can get it, but the very first one or two throws a bit lower. And-Or doing the two or three latest throws just a little bit higher to have the launch better well-spaced. (0 votes)
  3.   All on the exact height required (from first throw on), thus also in the right tact. (2 votes)
  4.   Different ways, or all of the above, or depending on which pattern, which number, or with a special initial throw or kick, or with a siteswap, or from juggling a lower number (only part of the props) with full hands. (1 vote)

7b_wizard -

Hey folks! Is everyone still theeeeeere?

  1. Yeeeesss!
  2. Erhm, yes.

This is a competition thread which ran from 24th Aug 2016 to 23rd Sep 2016. View results.

Marvin - - Parent

This poll has now ended. No one voted.

I know that feeling.

Orinoco - - Parent

*snigger*

7b_wizard - - Parent

yeh, like him: http://eelslap.com/

7b_wizard -

Where to best upload any juggling video  ( be it tutorial, 'show off', stage act, practise, a record, a trick clip, .. )  for any purpose   ( feedback, present oneself or a pattern, talk about the vid, get most attention, ask for analysis, park it there, .. )  ?

  1. any video upload server will do and make it available and linkable
  2. vimeo
  3. youTube
  4. JTV
  5. Instagram
  6. your own homepage
  7. Facebook
  8. other

Where would you want  a l l  juggling videos gathered?

This is a competition thread which ran from 10th Aug 2016 to 28th Aug 2016. View results.

The Void - - Parent

4.

barnesy - - Parent

What a s u r p r i s e

Richard Loxley - - Parent

I think it depends where your audience is.

Juggling TV is great if you want general jugglers to see it.

Facebook is great if you want your friends (or a members of a particular group) to see it.

Other sites are great if you want a general audience to see it.

It's worth talking about the amount of "friction" involved in viewing a video. There are so many competing calls for attention that it's worth making it as easy as possible for someone to see it.

For instance, I use Facebook via an app. If I see a video I fancy, then if it's a Facebook-hosted video, I can watch it immediately. If it's hosted elsewhere, a different app is loaded to view the video, taking 5-10 seconds. And chances are when I return to the Facebook app it's lost my place in my timeline. So personally when browsing Facebook I'm ten times more likely to watch a Facebook-hosted video than a video hosted anywhere else. The same goes for Twitter (with Twitter-hosted videos).

So I'd definitely recommend hosting the video on the same platform where you will be publicising it, for that reason.

On the web, it's a little easier, as many platforms embed videos in the webpage. For the web I'd recommend YouTube (and to a lesser extent Vimeo) as most forum software, etc, recognises them and embeds them automatically.

Make it easy for people to see the video and you'll get loads more views.

But ultimately, pick the audience first, then use that to decide where to publish.

Little Paul - - Parent

But ultimately, pick the audience first, then use that to decide where to publish.

This. Publish it where your intended audience expect to see it.

If your audience is in multiple places (eg split across facebook and youtube) publish in both places.

7b_wizard - - Parent

If there were an agreed upon (best) 'central' platform for juggling videos, the audience would be right there.

Little Paul - - Parent

So your audience is *specifically* people who are already looking for juggling videos?

Seems a bit narrow to me.

What if your audience is the general public, who don't know they want to watch a juggling video? How would they know to look in your 'central' platform?

7b_wizard - - Parent

Isn't that mostly the case ("people looking for juggling are the audience")? How would general public find a juggling video on e.g. youTube other than by hitting "juggling" into search bar, or by a juggling video being proposed in the "see also"s? Sure, you can upload it 'out of context' to any platform.
But you can just aswell link an uploaded video anywhere, your audience hangs out (being uploaded on a preferred 'central' for juggling videos doesn't mean, it's viewed only from there, and posting it somewhere doesn't require it to have been also uploaded there).

Kelhoon - - Parent

well, they apparently do find them given how many non-jugglers have told me about juggling videos

the last one someone told me about was the solving 3 cubes while juggling them, but they were solved so fast I am pretty sure it was faked or gimmicked

Little Paul - - Parent

Depends on the type of video.

If your video is of you doing siteswaps in your back garden, and your anticipated audience is "other jugglers" then yes, it's reasonable to assume that people who want to see it are going to be searching specifically for juggling videos.

If your video is a promo video, promoting yourself as a professional entertainer looking for business - then people who want to book you aren't likely to be looking specifically for a juggler, they're more likely to be looking more generally for entertainers.

If you've set out to make a well produced video, that happens to feature a juggler (Like for example the stuff Norbi puts out) then the sort of people who appreciate that style of video aren't likely to be searching specifically for juggling - but if it pops up in their instagram/tumblr feed they'll watch it.

If you're setting out to make a video that gets a lot of views so you can make some ad-revenue off it (like for example Bob & Trish do with their trick shot videos) then posting them in a central juggling video repository makes no sense - the viewers who are likely to watch/share it aren't searching for juggling, they're searching for "funny" or "awesome" or whatever.

If all your friends use facebook, posting a video for them to watch on Bebo makes no sense.

See what I mean?

Just because *you're* watching juggling videos by searching for the word "juggling" doesn't mean every potential viewer is.

7b_wizard - - Parent

Hm. I see. That makes the poll somewhat futile, if people post their juggling video as "see what I did"-video or as "Hire this artist"-video anywhere anyway.

7b_wizard - - Parent

                                    4
[brainstorm:]
@ 1 - Any server doesn't offer hashtags, categories, juggling related chat or forum, no features.
@ 2 - vimeo lately shuts my browser (mozilla 16); and when it worked before, it had staggered framerate on my system.
@ 3 - Woe! .. lemming's mainstream .. I was on our tube before it was google+. My account got inaccessible unless I gave google+ my mobile phonenumber. Hey, What?! .. I'm not giving them my mobilephone number! How about people worldwide in poor countries, or people who just don't use mobile, all people with PC, but without mobile (for whatever reason that really isn't google+'s business) .. they're being excluded. How dare they even ask for your number!?
  That streaming doesn't always work well, sometimes the videos freeze and don't skip and not replay anymore on my system. Search function and results are imo a catastrophe.
@ 4 - JugglingTV - haven't found any flaw - there's hashtags, comments, categories, sortable, everything. It's upto uploaders to set the hashtags and choose a title or description for their vids to be found later again. And it looks like ("from jugglers for jugglers") .. looks like the full rights remain with the uploader.
@ 5 - I don't see why I should register and-or install any instagram-software just to watch a video. My puter does perfectly fine watching videos (in some common old formats lol). I'm in general not pumping my machine full with updates on every switching it on. You can't watch a video as "guest"? You're 'welcome', when you register and use their software only ( for watching a video!!??? Are the pics for free lol? Will the text get crypted soon? )
@ 6 - personal homepage is different: it's only your videos, not a collection, not an all juggler's plattform. Doesn't seem to make sense on behalf of a 'central for all juggling videos'.
@ 7 - FB.. same as uTube and instagram .. you can't watch as guest, have to be registered .. mainstream for 'insiders' excluding 'outsiders'?
@ 8 - no idea what that could be .. a 'futuristic juggvid upload and sharing platform' ? That's JTV, right.
[end brainstorm]

7b_wizard - - Parent

JTV's search function could be better, maybe, .. just full plain text with option (+ - "" "every \ all \ any") and show the matches.  ( Again it's up to users to enter meaningful words in their desriptions if they care for their vid be found ).  Not them cursed "did-you-mean-algorithms". (But i don't know)

7b_wizard - - Parent

.. and btw .. I have core-blocked google, google analytics, google-syndication (what the heck is that?) in my HOSTS!! (and I believe, machine is double as fast browsing, but I can't prove for sure) .. just to be clear on this.  ( I'm also not on FB - you can't even find worldwide doublegangers there ;o]) ) 

Orinoco - - Parent

For those that tried to vote for option 4 before 13:00 GMT today (Thursday 11th), your vote was not counted due to the autolinking of jtv to jtv. I bodged a fix during my lunch break that allowed voting & put a proper fix in just now.

As you were.

7b_wizard - - Parent

Thank you!

Marvin - - Parent

This poll has now ended. The results are:

  1.   any video upload server will do and make it available and linkable (0 votes)
  2.   vimeo (0 votes)
  3.   youTube (3 votes)
  4.   JTV (4 votes)
  5.   Instagram (0 votes)
  6.   your own homepage (0 votes)
  7.   Facebook (0 votes)
  8.   other (0 votes)

7b_wizard -

How happy are you with  a l l  your props, the  w h o l e  set*, your equipment, your gear as a whole, that you use most for juggling, for your (main) practise, all those props that you really need?

  1. All perfect.
  2. Pretty much okay, all in all, just this or that could be notably better.
  3. So-so. Okay, so far. I would or could maybe wish for much better, but they're clearly good enough.
  4. Not really what I wish for. ``Jugglable´´, better than e.g. tennisballs, than e.g. some replacement, that's all.
  5. Not happy at all. I need better ones!
  6. [other]

[ * "available" props - needn't be your own, whatever you usually get into your hands ]

This is a competition thread which ran from 4th Aug 2016 to 21st Aug 2016. View results.

Mike Moore - - Parent

Selected 2. Love my beanbags. I'd really like an absolute ring or two, but they're hard to find these days.

James Hennigan - - Parent

2

I've used SRX russians for over 2 years now and I can't imagine switching. I'm surprised at how uncommon they are.

Other than that I just use 1 club for balancing.

Ben Clarke - - Parent

1, I love my props, sport co for toss juggling, 400gr play 5 inch ball for contact, 3 inch acrylics from renegage for multiball contact...
That said, I have just got a set of norwiks and am interested in switching to them for a while to try them out for tossing, but they feel soooo different than bean bags!

Ben Clarke - - Parent

Sorry, replied to wrong thread and can't figure out how to move or delete my post. :(

Orinoco - - Parent

Don't worry, stuff like that gets corrected by magic.

noslowerdna - - Parent

1

Marvin - - Parent

This poll has now ended. The results are:

  1.   All perfect. (1 vote)
  2.   Pretty much okay, all in all, just this or that could be notably better. (10 votes)
  3.   So-so. Okay, so far. I would or could maybe wish for much better, but they're clearly good enough. (3 votes)
  4.   Not really what I wish for. ``Jugglable´´, better than e.g. tennisballs, than e.g. some replacement, that's all. (0 votes)
  5.   Not happy at all. I need better ones! (0 votes)
  6.   [other] (0 votes)

7b_wizard -

Can you remember your very first ever juggling trick?

  1. 2 ball shower.
  2. 1hd 2 ball. (no matter columns or bows)
  3. 2 ball cascade (3b cascade with a gap, "330").
  4. 2 ball wimpy. (synch + crossing)
  5. other trick with 2 balls.
  6. 3 ball cascade.
  7. 3 ball reverse cascade.
  8. 3 ball columns.
  9. other trick with 3 balls.
  10. other prop, clubs, rings ..
  11. 2 or 3 scarves or light fabric.

[ *If you don't remember well, feel free to chose which you think it was most likely.* ]

This is a competition thread which ran from 30th Jul 2016 to 29th Aug 2016. View results.

Mike Moore - - Parent

Somehow, juggling had never occurred to me as a kid, so I don't think I ever did 2b in one hand, nor a 2b shower. The person who taught me just said "start with the hand with two, and keep throwing under the other ball", so I didn't try 330 until later, either.

pumpkineater23 - - Parent

I've never really thought of the 2b cascade (with two hands) as juggling. Yes, it's throwing balls but you don't really get the 'juggling feeling' until 3b cascade I think?

7b_wizard - - Parent

Agreed - one more prop than you have hands. So I'd count 1 hd 2b.

( But for sure 2b + bodythrows or 2b + trick handmoves, or + contact is "juggling"! Seen that way, "juggling" starts with 1 prop and is a big big topic. ) Maybe it's the moment where you give up focus on a thrown (or rolled, whatever) prop, 'let loose', and use the flighttime to do sth else.

7b_wizard - - Parent

& a 0prop juggling pantomime is on the border to juggling blind :o) .. with as many imagined props as you can handle Xo])

pumpkineater23 - - Parent

Correction - Apologies I meant the 2b shower (not cascade). Like LP mentioned, 2b shower doesn't really seem to inspire. The juggling begins that moment the third cascade throw is released.. I think. I can still remember that 'moment'.

Daniel Simu - - Parent

I never thought of doing the cascade as doing a trick. The first tricky trick I learned was the factory. Which made me push my 2 in one hand skill and columns skill, but I had never really practiced them until someone showed me the factory.

Little Paul - - Parent

I can remember clearly doing a 2 ball shower with rounders balls when I was in the last year of primary school (about 29 years ago)

But that is at least 5 years before what I usually think of as learning to juggle.

Marvin - - Parent

This poll has now ended. The results are:

  1.   2 ball shower. (2 votes)
  2.   1hd 2 ball. (no matter columns or bows) (1 vote)
  3.   2 ball cascade (3b cascade with a gap, "330"). (0 votes)
  4.   2 ball wimpy. (synch + crossing) (0 votes)
  5.   other trick with 2 balls. (0 votes)
  6.   3 ball cascade. (2 votes)
  7.   3 ball reverse cascade. (1 vote)
  8.   3 ball columns. (0 votes)
  9.   other trick with 3 balls. (0 votes)
  10.   other prop, clubs, rings .. (0 votes)
  11.   2 or 3 scarves or light fabric. (0 votes)

View older threads

Subscribe to this forum via RSS
1 article per branch
1 article per post

Green Eggs reports